The time has come. There are no more words needing to be said. Here’s to all of us – for the dark times we’ve had to get through in recent footballing years, and for the memories we’ve written as a club historically.
All that’s left to say is COME ON YOU VILLA BOYS!!! I’m off to get ready to get to Villa Park to get one of the coaches!
Here’s to us coming back home with the cup!
The Author
Matt Turvey
Matt is the owner of, and chief writer for, Aston Villa Life. He is also a columnist for the Wolverhampton Express & Star, appearing in the Kick Off pullout on Saturdays and the Final Whistle pullout the Monday after Aston Villa play, as well as every Thursday as a blogger on their website. He has previously been featured as a writer on Football365 and Life's A Pitch, and was a regular pundit for Sports Tonight TV on Sky.Comments 454
Leave a Reply
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Here’s to all Villans…I hope it’s a wonderful day.
As far as the result, let’s just give a good account of ourselves and let the chips fall as they may.
COYVB!
My son and I will be catching the train shortly. Lots of Gooners around our way, so it will be great to show the flag.
Super picture Matt. And how appropriate. The British were the complete underdogs at Waterloo and under Wellington the British Army won its greatest-ever victory. Villa are the complete underdogs today and under Field Marshall Sherwood we could add another glorious chapter to the story of Aston Villa FC. History beckons for Delph, Grealish and Benteke. What a prospect!!
I hope we win for every Villa fan out there. It’s been years of pain and embarrassment but today we could get our pride back. Stoke fans, WBA fans, scum fans etc will hate to us lift the cup
I hope our lads don’t bottle it.
COYVB!!!!
Wish all Villans going to Wembley an enjoyable and safe trip.
Hopefully the lads bring home the silverware.
COYVB!
It’s finally here – our day at Wembley and the excitement and nerves cranking up by the hour . To all lifers going to Wembley : have a fantastic day and bring the cup back to Brum . Just heard Gabby saying he’s fulfilling his wildest dream today and I can see him scoring the winning goal – as it really is the stuff of dreams . With Tim Sherwood we can expect a brave and attacking performance .
St75 – behave where you’re sitting !! Xx
Ps Smart new format Matt and photo – just brilliant John L
Frem – I don’t think we will bottle it – this is Sherwood’s team and no better person to motivate them . My biggest fear is us being too hung ho – but hell – Gabby just said we are gojng for it and that’s the way we will upset Arsenal . Prediction 4-2 to Aston Villa . Bebteke 2, Grealish and Gabby .
I expect a finger-biter with the Gunners to be winning 2-1 with 20 minutes to go…
… but Villa to be true Villans and to win 3-2 in extra time. Benteke (2) and Gabby with a 110th minute goal.
Squeaky bum time if we turn up we’ll win it have a great day villans. COYVB
Fancy a 2-1 victory today with a few heart stopping moments along the way.
Lads and Lasses here we are can i wish us all the best of luck lets hope the lads make us and those famous colours really proud.
I loved the flag outside the sty well done to those lads for again showing invention and class.
AVFC ITWT
Lucky it’s still 0-0.
Two yellows.
C’mon Villa!
That goal was inevitable. Villa can’t hang on to the ball.
Men versus boys, but dreadful selection decision to play N’Somnia…
This is where I fear that Sherwood is not the man to improve the team next season. Energy and enthusiasm is not enough next season.
Actually feel very sorry for Gabby sitting watching from bench . Hope to see him on for second half – Grealish and Zog ineffectual today .
Aye. So far Zoggy and Grealish have been ineffectual. The gulf in class is evident, could’ve been 3-0. Delph is doing pretty well despite being heavily marked.
May as well bring on a couple of subs. Bacuna?
Great strike from Sanchez! 2-0.
This should remind everyone that Villa finished in the shameful position of 17th and actually deserved to be relegated. I can’t remember Arsenal overrunning anyone else this badly…embarrassing!
Paul
Dead right! We need significant investment in the team.
3-0
It’s turning into the hiding we all feared.
Where’s Gabby? Is he hiding?
Nzogbia is like starting with ten would of gone bacuna there to strenthen the right . grealish cannot make up for a lack of runners/options . maybe step to far today, sanchez is a great player looks similar to errr Gil
Not sure why the commentators are so surprised by a team who lost 6-1 2 weeks ago and 1-0 last week to Burnley. Villa are quite simply a pile of sh!t.
Grealish has been better in the second half, definitely good enough for the PL.
Should have been a penalty, Gabby brought down.
Villa playing better, too late:(
4-0
Is this the most one sided FA up final in the last 25 years?
Villa were lucky to get nil…what a shambles!
Gutless and outplayed well at least tim now knows we need change
Trinity…yes it was
Feel sorry for the traveling fans.
Will Randy open his cheque book, now?
Thought Carlos Sanchez looked the part when he came on.
The kids are crying, Prince William’s face is red. Oh crikey!
trinity
the only thing we want from randy is to f### off and fast he has destroyed our club it was like sherwood replacing lambert ,lerner replacing ellis
Congratulations to Arsenal. They weren’t complacent, demonstrated their class and won pretty easily.
Be interesting to hear comments from the traveling fans.
Ignoring the dire ref. we we awful. Poor team selection and tactics lost us that match. I have kept quite on here regarding sherwood. Not doubting his motivation skills but he is no manager and Fred next season with him at the helm.
Well we knew we needed our A game from 11 players
we cant afford to play with 3 in midfield against top teams gives nobody a chance.
Gutless, pathetic, clueless, pitiful, all apply, Sherwood went without an enforcer again and Arsenal pissed possession. Could have been 10, never want to see 7 of this team in a Villa shirt again.
Marks –
Given – 2
Hutton – 2
Richardson – 3
Vlaar – 4
Okore – 2
Cleverley – 2
Westwood – 0
Grealish – 3
Delph – 3
Zog – 0
Benteke – 1
Subs –
Gabby – 0
Bacuna – 2
Sanchez – 2
IMO Sherwood produced a miracle last season, is he the man to manage Aston Villa ? no chance.
Sickening to watch the idiot Lerner laughing his knackers off at the end and crawling around HRH, the sooner this knob pisses off the better for the club, fans and city of Birmingham.
Bit harsh on westwood steamer he was like the boy with his finger in the dyke. Wonder if ts has thrown that plan away?
We’ve just had 11 goals scored against us in the last 3 matches, think Villa scored 1-2.
steamer agree with you on most
hutton richardson VLAR cleverly westwood zog plus YOUR FAVOURITE GABBY what a joke
mark k
westwood is lower level player at best
lerner is a plague on sports clubs
until next year lads and Jenny!
James,
By the way, those marks were out of a hundred.
Someone reckons by an interview today that TS is leaving.
By the way, i thought Given should have saved the second, dunno what Owen was on about, but then does anyone ?
Think that just about ends my interest in AVFC, wasn’t even going to watch the game till 5pm, Ellis and Lerner have killed it for me.
steamer
all of this is because of 9 years inept leadership didnt always agree with mon but wherent many shows like today bar chelsea 71
the last 5 years have been horrendous 100 million spent and benteke is all to show for it
seen the comment earlier about sherwood walking and would any one really blame him we need minimun 50/60 million spent in summer on 5/6 players
“…seen the comment earlier about sherwood walking and would any one really blame him we need minimun 50/60 million spent in summer on 5/6 players”
That’s about right.
Oh, dear oh dear … I’m more worried about the future of that penguin than anything else!
Now, common lads, we’re bound to have a knee-jerk reaction to today’s performance. I wouldn’t have minded so much if we’d lost and given them something to worry about. But we didn’t.
As to Sherwood? His career is only just beginning and in some ways today’s match was maybe for the better, as it must surely have showed him clearly what has to be done.
TS will work hard during the summer I’m sure – and whatever happens re: CB we’ll still have a much better season next season. Well, that’s what I expect, but if it doesn’t happen then … mmmm.
By the way, don’t let’s forget to give the Gunners credit for having worked out exactly was required and executing the plan to perfection. They were good – very good.
JL
I think TS knows what needs doing. Will Lerner give him the funding? If he doesnt, doesn’t matter who the manager is. Let’s hope Lerner comes through.
Please let’s get things in perspective.
Yes, the ref was crap and Villa could have had two penalties, or at least a penalty and a free kick, but Villa were rubbish despite Arsenal’s superior players and performance.
Villa did not turn up in the FA Cup today, but then again they did not turn up against Southampton and Burnley.
But for Hull not winning at home against Burnley, Villa would be relegated, dead and blinking buried.
Which is more important, Premiership survival or a first FA cup win since 1957?
Did we really want to follow Wigan, FA Cup winners in 2013 into the murky depths of Division 1?
Please do not start blaming Tim Sherwood for Villa’s shortcomings all ye of of tiny memories.
If Sherwood had not replaced Lambert, Villa would have been relegated long ago.
Tim Sherwood inherited a group of players, from the bargain basement after the January transfer window and at the very least he instilled a modicum of pride in them. He has done as much as he can with the raw material at his disposal.
What do some of you want, a miracle worker?
The transformation in the second half in the quarter final against West Brom was something to behold. West Brom should have won that match easily. But for Sherwood’s intervention at half-time Villa would not have even reached the semi-final.
He built on that performance sufficiently for Villa to escape relegation.
Who knows what the future holds for Villa with a new owner in prospect?
I am severely brassed off, but knowing that Villa have at least another season in the Premiership is a positive thought.
Well said, Godfrey! 🙂
Trinity,
I honestly don’t think it’s about blasting big sums of money to find a team.
We do have serious problems in the full-back area and also the goalkeeper – I agree with Steamer that Given again showed some shortcomings today, but his defence didn’t help him too much. I’d love to see Clark back … and maybe Baker should be played at l-b, which is supposed to be his original position.
Grealish didn’t show too well for the last few matches. He and Zoggy provided no penetration today to speak of, so we need a strong player to replace Zoggy and allow Jack to develop.
Assuming Cleverley and CB go, then we will need about 7 new players to make up a good enough squad. But how much we need to spend I don’t think is the big issue, unless you want to try to but success.
“… unless you want to try to buy success.”
Point is, though. Villa needs big investment in new players.
Today, merely highlighted what we already knew.
Goodnight lads. It’s 4:57 am here.
Trinity: “Point is, though. Villa needs big investment in new players.”
Well, ‘fraid we disagree. If you have a manager who is good on the motivational side of things (which TS id, i.m.o.) then he can produce success from lesser-known players – so long as they have the basic ability and will to take the opportunity.
john l
how much did soton pay for forester bertrand around 10m each going rate for good players mind not world class
we need keeper 2full backs where has sissko gone looked alright most of season at least one centre half please god don t give vlar new contract need players who are fit at least 90 percent season, ,need at least one centre mid still hoping sanchez gets preseason be ok
up front kozak out for 18 months with broken leg what is that all about ,helnius on painkiller addiction weare mighty fucked up
We still don’t know who leaked the dossier to Crystal Palace and why Karsa and Culverarse were booted, what with the persecution of the supporters clubs show just how much is wrong with AVFC, the club is rotten.
James …
When you get up in the morning, do you bother to listen to the song the birds sing? 😉
The situation is not as serious as is being made out to be … And you certainly don’t build a team just by spending. It takes a good manager to find a way with £20-30m for several new players and we’ll just have to see how TS does and how good he is.
Trin,
Thanks for turning up mate, pity the team didn’t.
The outcome today was never in doubt. More worrying is that without significant investment in quality players, not least a complete new back 4, there will not be 3 worse teams next season. Given that Sherwood still makes schoolboy selection errors (okore, Cnz etc) I don’t see him as the man to take Villa forward
Honest interview by TS.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/32948210
All depends on a takeover then, Lerner & Fox out.
Well, that was certainly underwhelming. Never got out of first gear. And Arsenal played very well.
As far as selection, I don’t think TS got much wrong. There’s really not much more to work with. The only departure from our best performances under Sherwood was Hutton. I probably would’ve picked the same side.
You could argue maybe Sinclair for CNZ, and Bacuna instead of Hutton, but really I don’t know that it would’ve made much difference. Baker instead of Okore? Don’t know what that would’ve changed, either, to be honest.
Just shows what we knew…there’s a lot of work ahead.
The only thing that really puzzles me in terms of selection is Given over Guzan. I think Guzan’s the better all-round keeper. Shay still has good reactions, and made a couple good saves, the first one in particular, but otherwise I just don’t see why you’d go with him, having no long-term future, and basically leave yourself needing to go get another keeper when you’ve got one that’s good enough. We’ve got more pressing needs, seems to me.
john l
sorry but to avoid relegation by the skin of our teeth for FOUR years in a row and its not a serious situation
we need major surgery and sorry if it offends but anyone thinks anything else go and see doc
lerner has brought us to our knees
and go back to when my favourite manager of last 30 years big ron came in sold platt and cas dismantled taylors team and within 2 years we where competing with the best
I do think an overhaul is needed…Have just listened to some of Sherwood’s comments, and I agree, the club have got used to losing, and there are a number of players that need to leave. Burnley might not have won today, but they’d have given Arsenal more of a fight.
Patients is a dirty word but its whats needed.
John, you say an overhaul is not needed. So who of the current squad do you think is good enough to leave Villa in a comfortable mid-table position, which is the target from where we are today?
…sorry I can’t read…you said overhaul is needed. I would only keep Clark, Delph and Grealish as 1st 11 starters. Not sure what happened to Gil…did he shag someone he shouldn’t have?
Yeah, I think I’m generally as patient as anyone on here, Mark. And I’m not thinking we should be challenging for CL places next year.
But I think Sherwood has to change as much as he can with the funds available. We’ve seen this group of players are capable of better, and perhaps it’s possible that it’s just a matter of mentality. Escaping again may have exhausted the team’s reserves. Dunno.
This performance, and the previous two, aren’t signs of a club that’s turned a corner, though.
Hats off too TS for keeping us up
the sqaud he inherited is a poor one imo
i find him lacking tactically with no plan b on a few occassions
If we think 30ml and ts can make us a good prem side we are kidding ourselves imo
major investment needed and if we want to be as good as teams like the gooners maybe a different manager
Paul-
I can’t really disagree. Delph, Grealish, Benteke if he stays, which he probably won’t now. Clark. I think Bacuna does offer something, but I couldn’t argue that there aren’t better RBs out there we could just bring in. Okore hasn’t been fit…I think he’ll be decent enough once he is. But again, if there were money, you could find better.
Maybe the team just got a bit dizzy after playing so much better, and can’t find it in themselves to believe that’s who they can be.
Runtings-
I’ll be curious to see what TS can do if he gets to build his own side. I think he can be good, but I certainly get the feeling he doesn’t want to be associated with this group. Is that him shirking responsibility? I don’t think so, not yet, anyway. He’s been very honest it seems to me, and he didn’t have anything to do with what he’s got to work with.
we have 3 right backs hutton 4.5 m lowton 3m bacuna 1.5 m thats about 9m in 4 years
think 5 left backs stevens .250 bennet 3.5 luna 2.5 bertrand on loan sissko 2.5
thats 8 fullbacks in 4 years some leadership
Good report in The Telegraph blaming Sherwood for poor tactics ie why go 3 in midfield v Arsenal 5…why not smother and counter attack when you will never outplay Arsenal. This tactic was successful for Swansea and Sunderland. Sherwood might argue that he set out to be more entertaining but it was ultimately suicide.
Well that was painful. Sherwood got it wrong today. Zoggy and Grealish can’t play together. Both slow the game down to much. We had no width, no pace. So easy for arsenal
I like Sherwood but he has to learn. Play with width. He’s said there will be changes in the summer and to many players have a losing mentality.
Gutted. Hope new owners are in soon
Gents,
Arsenal were simply in a different league. Not one Villa player would have been chosen for the Gunner’s squad. Villa appeared poor in large part because Arsenal were so good. They could easily have scored 6 or 7. The game also showed the great gulf in class between Arsenal and Liverpool.
We escaped relegation by the skin of our teeth, helped by Burnley beating Hull. We need a period of ownership and managerial stability, supported by meaningful investment.
So. Villa finish 15th 16th 15th 17th in 4 years. Somehow in some miracle we have not got relegated.
Tim has worked a miracle to keep us up and then also get in the cup final.
Play arsenal in final. Arsenal finish 3rd villa 17th. Arsenal are 8-0 up on agg in the 2 prem games.
Villa loose final.
Cue meltdown.
Unbelivable.
NOTHING has changed. We need a new owner and new player…just like the last 3 fucking years.
Anyone who is shocked or THAT UPSET we lost to arsenal….sanchez, cazorlo etc needs there fucking head tested.
Get in the real world
Lol, who are you having a go at Andrew ? Know one has had a meltdown, it’s actually you having the melt down 🙂
Everyone is is devastated which is normal.
Sherwood has said we need I build a new team and has promised fans things will get better. It’s iver to him now and the owners hopefully
UTV
And to say people who are upset that we lost to Arsenal need there head testing is just unbelievable really. People love this club. There were kids in tears at the game. Fans fighting. It hurts
Don’t you dare say fans need there head testing because they are upset we lost to Arsenal . I’m bloody devastated as are the other 20 odd thousand inside Wembley
It’s emotional stuff, losing on the big stage. Easy to say it’s just a bonus, but when you get there, you want to win.
The last four years have been awful. And it was perhaps cruel that we got into the final. But, the performance that got us there was part of the streak that saved us. The joy, and the hope, the semi brought us was all we had to savor this year. Well, that and knocking Albion out.
I do think it’s going to get better…Sherwood’s got the ego and drive to make something happen.
JL
I didn’t see your post “… unless you want to try to buy success.” before getting some kip.
You’re right about Zoggy re: Grealish.
No doubt, TS is a skilful motivator, make a good school teacher, but do all our players have enough will? Do they have a winning mentality? I’m writing this with the benefit of hindsight having heard TS answer no to these questions.
Another problem is that so many of our players seem to spend most of the season injured year after year, especially centre backs. TS said he will bring in more “durable” players.
We don’t have the wherewithal to “buy success”, but with the TV money and a bit of ambition etc, Villa can do miles better. I don’t mean to sound patronising, you know a lot more about Villa than I’ll ever know, but at least you’ve seen not only the lean years, but some great ones, too.
I’m amazed at how forgiving the younger generation is. They’ve never seen Villa win anything, yet many still have hope and cheerfully support AVFC.
Morning frem……was an agressive post…..sorry very drunk. Long old day for us villans!
Sorry still find it mental own fans were fighting each other. Thats prob more to being drunk and stupid than the actual result!
Cant get my head around tears and over reaction of losing to arsenal…..99% of me thought we was going to loose.
By the way i thought okore was fantastic. First sec to last he battled everything.
JC
I agree. If TS gets the tools he needs, something could happen. He hates losing. I think, having lost a final like that will greatly motivate Sherwood to have another serious crack at it.
Another highlight was beating Spurs, hadn’t done that for a few tears, either.
…for a few years, either:).
Need to stop playing two number 10s
Loved the arsenal formation and think it suits are players.
Whatscwrong with
4231
Clevery delph
Gill. Grealish. Sinclar
Tekkers
As the 2 3 1
Andrew
Yeah. Both Arsenal and Southampton caught us on the break a lot.
Will TS relent with Gil?
Hope you feel better.
Good to see some more +ve comments today … about the future.
It was very sad. BUT … it just shows how TS managed to raise expectations since February. If we were to think back we were very angry about what was taking place then under Lambert, but suddenly a new broom came in and … raised hopes.
But, of course, TS had to use the same squad of players that Lambert left. All he could do was to motivate them out of their slumbers to do better … and he achieved that sufficiently long enough for them to get big ideas and then be blown off course by the Saints. I think that helped to remind the players that they were not as good as they were beginning to think they could be and since then they’ve not shown much.
Only when Gabby came on did the sense of urgency seem to get sparked, but he didn’t find enough help and it was then too late. The third and fourth goals were given away, but Arsenal deserved their win.
Well, TS has the summer to start building his OWN team. We can expect better days, I’m sure. Lambert *has* gone!
Just to cheer you up …
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxsh7WsmK8c
Genius at work.
This performance, and the previous two, aren’t signs of a club that’s turned a corner, though.
Accurate enough JC.
Andrew,
Don’t think TS wanted Sinclair. For someone who preaches good football he seems to have a blind spot for players like Sinclair & Gil who really should walk into such a poor team. Also to play no enforcer with a weak B4 is suicidal, Cissoko is our best defensive FB, so play him especially as Arsenal use the flanks.
Talking of walking did anyone think that Gabby looked like a double wardrobe being pushed ( slowly) around the pitch when he came on ?
Right, players out this close season – Given, Steer, Hutton, Cole, Gabby, Westwood, obvious, plus he doesn’t rate Sanchez, Cissoko or Gil so its going to cost a few bob to pay off those contracts and find enough finance to make signings. Can’t see Clev or Benteke being here unless there’s a takeover.
Apparently Gil & Weiman told to find other clubs last week.
Everyone is absolutely gutted about the level of our performance yesterday. The truth is we were completely outclassed by an exceptional football team. Sanchez, Ozil and Cazorla cost Arsenal around £95 million and they all played to their potential. Our midfield could not compete with their movement and skill.
This will be a huge summer for Aston Villa. Sherwood performed a MIRACLE keeping us in the premier league. Surely Randy has learned his lesson. He will sell the club this summer as he will not want to spend a single penny on new transfer acquisitions. It wouldn’t surprise me if he sells Benteke quickly, pockets the £30M and then sells the club to interested parties for £150m.
It will be interesting to see who actually buys the club and what their motivation is? Will TS still remain the manager?
We shall see.
Andrew- To be fair, before KO, when the flags were waving, hi ho aston villa being sang, the national anthem being sang, I don’t think there would have been any Villa fan in that stadium hat would have thought we couldn’t have won. We could have. It’s a one of game, anything could off happened.
Agree about not playing two number 10’s. we can only play them if we have Gabby running in behind up top. Benteke won’t get in behind, he shows for the ball, as do Zoggy and JG, everything was backwords and slowed down. when Gabby came on we had pace and he was our best player
Play Grealish cutting in from the left, then have someone like Bacuna or Sinclair giving us width from the balance
TS better remain as manager. He needs until Xmas at least to see if he has the tactical know how. I want him to rebuild a new squad this summer, with or without Randy
Notice how TS kept his distance from the players after the whistle. Thats because he knows he will be getting rid of most of them, even benteke probably
Guzan, Given, Bacuna, Hutton, Lowton, Sender, Vlaar, Baker, Sissy, Richardson, Luna, Sanchez, Gil, Wiemann, Gabby i’d like to see all go. Benteke and Clev I think will go also
Huge summer ahead.
Lets not over exaggerate Arsenals abilities, Chelsea always smash them but for some reason they don’t get the plaudits, also look at the average teams that knock them out of the Euro comps. They have some very good players like ex Barca reserve, Sanchez, but yesterday Villa would have made virtually any team look like Barcelona.
Well its certainly the “morning after the night before” time. For those who made the long trip and paid a lot of money, it must be worse for the ones like me who watched it on tv. On my fb, I saw how long it took people to get back home – and it’s a hell of a long way back after a loss – for any game. So my reflections are, I admit, without the investment that the Wembley goers have made.
So what happened. Quite simply Wenger had done his homework and got his tactics spot on. Helped along by some world class players, the likes of which we can only dream about, Arsenal outsmarted us and out played us They were magnificent and probably gave their best performance of the season. Coming off the back of three convincing wins, they dominated from the off. This was expected – but what what came as a shock was how easily we were dispossessed and lost our confidence.
I don’t hold with the “players didn’t put the effort it or didn’t care enough.” This was a cup final at Wembley – they will have fantasised about opportunities like this as soon as they started school boy football – and not just the villa fans like JG and Gabby either. They put the effort in but Arsenal stifled them and knocked them off the ball like candles being snuffed out. Ten minutes of this and their confidence was shaken and they reverted back to type – bad decision making, passing etc. Tim Sherwood has been a fantastic motivator – but when things don’t go to plan like yesterday – it isn’t just as simple as having a “winning mentality”.
This brings me on to TIm Sherwood. I have been his biggest fan , he has galvanised the team and produced fantastic performances. But yesterday, he deserves to take some of the responsibility. It is pointless playing the blame game but if we are to progress, lessons need to be learned , rather than falling back on the ill thought out response of “they have got a losing mentality”. In retrospect the team selection may have contributed to the situation. There also appeared to be no plan B from him – whether or not he had the players to effect one. The fact is JG looked frozen on the Wembley stage (understandable if not predictable) and our midfield was embarrassing. I think there is too much sentimentality over JG and maybe the hype is giving him the wobbles. He should have been substituted – an 18 year old kid is not the match for the world class players Arsenal have and it was an occasion too big for him.
It was clear early on that lumping balls into Benteke (a tactic which had previously paid off) was being thwarted by Czesny coming out to grab every one. The fact that we did not have a shot on goal is testament to the failed tactics I am afraid – and this is not typical of the SHerwood way – who has improved us immeasurably in this department. So what did we do ? We carried on doing the same – with the same result.
Benteke has come in for some flack on the OS . THis is unfair in my opinion. He was useful for the 10 or so corners Arsenal had and it wasn’t his fault that he was fed nothing form the MF.
What disappointed me the most though was Tim Sherwood’s reaction afterwards. A good manager won’t blame the players – Fergie didn’t, Mancini even took the blame on occasions saying he got it wrong. Even Morinho has admitted that he got it wrong. But to say they have got a losing mentality (an unpleasant criticism to make of professional sportsmen) and that some would be giving their marching orders is not the response of a good leader IMO. Do that in private but publicly when they must be feeling down after the public embarrassment is uneccessary. When we do well Tim Sherwood is happy to take the plaudits and his after team talks are littered with the word “I”. “I went into the dressing room” “I’ve been working on this with them” etc BUT when we fail the “I” becomes a “they” . It is early days for Tim Sherwood as a manager and maybe his sticking together with the team in the bad times as well as the good will come. It needs to.
Frem,
I think TS is an open book, when we were getting battered at Soton he looked absolutely livid, you can only imagine what he said after the game, same yesterday but most of these players are too stupid to take notice. As i said previously, TS deserves a contact and money to spend but i have serious doubts whether he is the right man for the job and his supposed policy of signing young lower division and English players is a non starter, we just don’t produce that many decent players.
Very good Jen, never noticed the i and they scenario. Hope all is well down in your part of the World.
Steamer,
Villa (to my mind) lost confidence as a result of the match at Saints. They’ve done nothing since to show any recovery in self belief and hence – you’re right – partly why they were outplayed so much yesterday. If the final had been played at the beginning it might have been a different story. Well, at least we’d have seen a better Villa performance I think.
But the Gunners *are* a good team in their footballing ability. Chelsea have something else, and it’s mainly a stubbornness of the kind that refuses to give ground, allied to just one or two good footballers. Arsenal (I give them credit) just try to play footie – and as I like it.
What was astonishing yesterday was that CB won so little in the air. Their c-b is taller, and their keeper good in coming off his line, so Villa’s ploy of pumping balls into the air was just wasted air space.
Come on, TS will get a better squad sorted I’ve no doubt. If he is had to be rid of Gil, then maybe there’s a good reason for it. Let’s just look ahead now.
Jenny- To be fair to TS, they are losers. They are use to losing as he says. He has blamed them because he knows 90% of them wont be playing under him next season anyway, Benteke and Clev probably included. we have a lot of crap in the sqaud, in fact it all is apart from 3 players i’d say
TS has a lot to learn as you say, on and off the pitch but I hope he gets some time to try and lean it. I want him to rebuild the squad, his squad, then he might stick with them. He has no reason to defend the players, there not his
Steamer – I am not sure I understand your logic regarding the abilities of Arsenal. They have extremely talented footballers and I believe they play the most attractive football in the Premier League. Consistently finishing in the top four for over a decade.
Chelsea do get the plaudits – they have been awesome this year – Hazard – Mattic – Fabregas – Costa are all gifted players and the media has been raving about their level of performance and consistency.
Villa didn’t turn up yesterday. It was hard to watch. The formation was wrong and it was clear that many of the players were not on their game. I would have taken off Nzogbia and Grealish at half time. Brought on Gabby and Sinclair – put five in midfield. There was no point waiting to go 2-0 down before making a change. But that is football.
TS inherited this squad and kept us in the league. I congratulate him for that.
It is clear there will be a major cull at the club. TS has always talked about playing a different way next season so he can include different players in the team. We shall see what that style of play looks like.
It is obvious he doesn’t want or rate certain players. I know for a fact that he did not want Sinclair – he doesn’t think he has the desire. And he doesn’t think Gil his fit enough. I think most Villa fans would want to see Gil in the team.
We will get rid of Weimann, Guzan , Bent, Lowton, Sissoko, Nzogbia, Senderos for sure. If we can move them on.
Huge summer for this club. It will be interesting to see who arrives at the club.
Jenny,
Very good comments, some of which I’ve just replicated not having seen your post.
But I think the *main* issue was that Villa have just lost confidence as a result of the Saints game. They lacked confidence and I think the only thing that TS did wrong was to not select Gabby from the start. His pace gave the Gunners some concern after he came on, but it failed to raise much more urgency from the other Villa players who sometimes seemed to play as though they were there for a walk in the park.
Ricahrd-Bacuna, Hutton need to go as well. Vlaar, and more
Morning all
the big TS qustion for me is his tactics – maybe he will get someone in to help with that but
even after two embarissing defeats he ddnt really come up with any ideas of how to plot a win vs the goooners — they way we set up played into there hands as they new exactly what ts would do
If he is in a position to spend 30mil then i dont think we could do much better than ts but if there is 150mil to spend i think a board with that kind of ambition would maybe want someone more experienced
Frem: “we have a lot of cr*p in the sqaud, in fact it all is apart from 3 players i’d say”
We have Okore, Clark, Vlaar, Baker, Delph and Grealish (6 players) who are likely to stay I think, and who represent the nucleus of a good side.
I would add Westwood and Gabby – I like them (you don’t!) and add something to the side in my view, but I agree we probably need better quality in those departments. They are at least good enough to retain in the squad, plus Hutton.
I’m assuming that CB and Cleverley will leave, but after yesterday I’m wondering whether Cleverley is worth keeping.
I forgot Vlaar – not sure whether I want to keep him.
I’m going nutty – I did mention Vlaar and clearly can’t make up my mind about him!!
John- Hutton is dire really. he can’t cross a ball. Vlaar, hes a free agent, let him go. baker, always injured.
Okore and westy I might agree with to be fair. Gabby, hes getting old and more useless
JL, you’re big on the effects of positive thinking and you’re right, positivity is important but so are good footballers. The losing mentality argument is a smoke screen, I think. Truth is most of our players aren’t good enough to compete in the top half of the Premier League. Personally, the only one I’d really be sorry to see the back of is Fabian Delph.
I don’t think Alan Hutton has a losing mentality. I do think he’s one of the worst right backs in the league. Charles N’Zogbia’s last 7 premier league finishes were 18th, 16th, 16th, 16th, 15th, 15th, 17th. Tells it’s own story – he’s paid a kings ransom and he’s not very good.
Same goes for Gabby. A “revitalised” Gabby has managed 6 goals this season. (CNZ no goals in 19 starts.) Steve Naismith scored 6 for Everton and he’s a pub footballer,
Tim Sherwood is confident bordering on arrogant and he’s exactly the right personality to overhaul our squad, to act as the new broom. He’s earned the right to take us into next season. Very few of the players can say the same thing.
I’d keep Clark
Richard S,
Don’t get me wrong mate, i thought Arsenal played nice footy yesterday but the way the media and commentators were bulling them up was unbelievable, you’d have thought they were Barca or Bayern, after all Theo Walcott, Mertesacker and Jack Wilshire are regulars so they can’t be that good.
Frem,
On Hutton you’re right but I just think as a straight defender he’s worth retaining as a squad player.
Gabby? Well he was the only one that seemed to think that we were at Wembley to win the Cup!! Gotta keep him – even as a squad player.
Andrew P.
Can’t argue with any of your points.
As Jenny mentioned, it was a long expensive day yesterday. Left home at 8:30 got back after midnight. Including the cost of 3 match tickets spent well over 500 quid I guess, and apart from the footballer it was a good day. Villa overran Kilburn and it was a pleasure to catch up with B6toBrasil and to meet Steamer 75. Hopefully we’ll do it again in happier circumstances.
Theres no doubt arsenal on there day are class apart. The midfield 5 have everything, the movement and passing is just silly.
Suicide really playing jack and nzog, they aint going to work back and help. midfield 3 and full backs hung out to dry. Ok playing them with intent of having a go…but we couldnt even do that.
Will be biggest, busyiest summer ever. Could be fun
Andrew P,
Yes, of course you’re right about the need for players of quality. I don’t disagree, but I’m just talking about a situation that TS has inherited.
You mention just Delph as quality, but people have raved about the performances of Okore and Clark from time to time. And everyone is pro Grealish from what I can gather although he has still to develop.
As i mentioned earlier, i think, barring a takeover, most of the clubs funds will go towards paying up contracts rather than paying large fees, even good players can be obtained for free certainly better than we have at the moment, Micah Richards is a Villan and won’t be able to retain his current wage, i’m sure we’d be able to put together a deal, lets go for players with a pedigree, lets think big for once.
Thought Zog was appalling from minute one. First out the door for me.
Andrew: “The [Arsenal] midfield 5 have everything, the movement and passing is just silly.”
Yep – totally agree – and not just that but they have players that seem to read the opponents intentions so easily as well, and get the ball off ’em.
They are clearly on a good run just now. But now the season’s finished and whether next season they can continue at that level remains to be seen.
Steamer – Sure, there absolutely no point in us arguing over the merits of Arsenal. The only thing that matters is Aston Villa.
We are all hurting after yesterday, after the last four years of abject misery. The humiliation we are all feeling is a back to reality check. I was worried going into the game after the debacle at Southampton. Arsenal had done their homework and the rest is history.
I was also disappointed with the comments of TS after the game – Jenny is right in her appraisal of that situation.
Aston Villa must learn their lessons. TS needs to get it right this summer. We need to use the money from the sale of Benteke to purchase quality footballers. We can all list the players we would like to see leave the club, in reality there is not many worth keeping. This will be left to the discretion of TS.
So let’s start with a quality centre forward to replace Benteke. And that man will be non other than Adebayor- right!!!!
Andrew P,
Pleasure to meet St75, how many Jager Bombs did you gargle ?
There was nothing wrong with what TS said for me. better than ” can’t fault thee effort”
He has no reason to be nice to them. he will probably want 5or 6 players to stay, thats about it
The rest, he will wan’t to go. he has no reason to be nice to the others. They are use to losing
Steamer, I met him before I’d even had a drink. He seemed like a proper bloke, but, then again, I am used to drinking with Bibulus.
JL, Clarke and Baker and Westwood and Cleverley and a couple of others have obviously got something, and on a good day are capable of making up numbers, but I wouldn’t be sorry if any of them left. I do like Baker but that’s probably only because he hasn’t been playing. For me, it’s way too early to form an opinion about Jack Grealish but would love him to do well.
Richard S,
What do you make of Adebayor ?
regarding the squad, i’d only keep Guzan, Richardson, Baker, Clark, Grealish, Gardner, Clev, Delph, Benteke, Robinson and Gil, dunno about Vlaar and Sendeross.
One of the things that encourages me about investment is that Sherwood seems likely to completely discard most of the squad and those pay-offs won’t come cheap, apparently Gil is on REALLY good wages.
Thats a good point Andrew P about JG, i think we’re losing contact with our roots, its all Yanks and Cockenees with no connection to the club, Clark, Baker, Grealish etc have been at VP for years and have that loyalty to the club, Villa people. The likes of Ian Taylor, Brian Little, John Gregory could all do a good job for us, get them on board after all we’re Birminghams only club.
Yes John, I agree entirely , The Saints demolition came at the worst time – not helped either by losing to championship team Burnley. There are a variety of factors at play I think. The research shows conclusively that there is a “new manager” uplift. as you would expect. Change gives hope and a different mentality . Stats show that this effect lasts 12 games. By this time – the players will determine whether their new found hope was justified I guess. We have lost three in a row – maybe good it’s at the end of the season – but any earlier could have been curtains for us.
I think Tim Sherwood’s affect on the team has been more than just “new manager uplift”. HE has shown that he can get the supporters (also important) and players like Benteke fired up and performing. But this is from a position of coming in after a poor manager and set of results. It is different task to get the same players and crowd who have suffered defeats under your management to recover the “winning mentality” and his performance now will show how great a motivator he really is – the difference between good and excellent.
Tim SHerwood chose to label our short comings yesterday as a “losing mentality” . I don’t like this description as it is judgemental. A more accurate description would be we “lacked confidence” IMO Words have deep psychological resonance and impact and the word “loser” packs a punch and not a nice one. I suspect he chose the “losing mentality” label as it puts the blame on them (ie this came about before his time) and takes responsibility away from him. If he had said “we lacked confidence ” there is an inference that he isn’t doing his job properly.
I am not anti TS – just assessisng him fairly. I was fully of praise for how he handled the 6-1 defeat when he took on the “team responsibility” mantle and protected them.
For all our weaknesses yesterday, you can’t take away the fact that both Sherwood and those same players have pulled off some great performances. Where was the “losing mentality” against Everton when we scored 4 goals to their 3.
I am fine thanks Steamer 🙂 Let’s hope the cheeky chappy behaved himself 🙂
There was a film about Sanchez before the game, showing the place he came from, how deprived his upbringing was and how much he has done for his people by going back, taking presents and building football pitches for the local kids. I know he is not the only footballer to give back, but it is heart warming to see, nevertheless.
Steamer, I agree with you that retaining a local identify is important, but at the moment I think what’s more important is the need for that new broom to sweep away all of the mediocrity and underachievers. Perhaps we could pay up Gabby’s contract and then give him Dave Ismay’s job whatever that was.
Steamer – what do i think of Adebayor. Unfortunately I live in Herts – and i have a lot of family and friends who are Spurs fans. Apparently Adebayor could not play this year for Spurs because his mother had used Jew Jew against him – she had cast a Voodoo spell to stop him from playing. Go figure that out.
I am gutted that we will lose Benteke and I think it will be a devastating blow for Aston Villa. Look what happens to teams when they sell their best players and squander that cash on mediocre players. Just look at Spurs and Liverpool after selling the likes of Bale, Modric and Suarez.
It will be a balancing act for TS. We do have some good players at Villa. Benteke, Delph, Clark, Sinclair, Gil, Baker, Vlar, Okore, Grealish. It all depends what style of play TS wants to play. I do believe we will be sold. And it all depends how much cash will be made available for transfers and more importantly wages. We cannot sell everyone. You really need a squad of 22 players competing for places in the starting 11.
Teams like arsenal have spent on one player what we have spent n the last few years
you pay for what you get in the main
its a new age of football were success can come from either huge investent or a clear progressive football philosphy
we still have niether
Steamer, on subject of local identity, I met Benjamin Zephaniah after the game yesterday. A real gentlemen. I don’t like the idea of club ambassadorial roles because it usually just means using a respected face to endorse the official line and sell season tickets or whatever, but I do think he’s a man who should have closer links to Villa.
Steamer: ” i think we’re losing contact with our roots, its all Yanks and Cockenees with no connection to the club”
Now come on, mate! 😉
Ramsay and McGregor came from Scotland and Rinder from Liverpool and London via Derby.
Fine contribution they made!!!!!!!! 🙂
Jenny: “There was a film about Sanchez before the game, showing the place he came from, how deprived his upbringing was and how much he has done for his people by going back, taking presents and building football pitches for the local kids. I know he is not the only footballer to give back, but it is heart warming to see, nevertheless.”
Yes, exactly. JPA was another that did a lot in his home country (Columbia) I believe, and that full-back – de la Cruz was it?
Agreed mainly on your other analysis. I think you’re being a bit hard on TS for the kind of criticism he is shelling out as I think this lot do need a lot kicking up the bums – and they will be, I’m sure, when they’re ejected from the club.
I feel that when TS gets the players he wants then his talk will be different. He must have been shell-shocked when he came into VP and found what he did. Just like when GT first came in in 1987 I imagine.
Wonder if Jew Jew prevents him picking up his wages ?
John – fair point about my “too harsh c riticism” and we also need to factor in the fact that TS had just watched his team played off the pitch – and his response was emotional and maybe after 24 hours to reflect may have been more measured. For team building and leadership excellence though – more we and less I is better. If he had said we “need more winning mentality” rather than “they have a losing mentality” is is IMO far better as it allows improvement whereas the label “losing mentality” is too static.
Andrew P – I’m a great fan of Benjamin Zephaniah -for the wonderful vids he has made of his villa connections (they showed another one yesterday) and as a talented poet. My daughter had his poems to study for GCSE and he is a great performer as well as poet. Lucky you to meet him -I agree , we need to embrace our local talented people – particularly one who writes with such passion and finesse. I read on another site that John GIdman wrote to villa asking for a Wembley ticket and he was refused one. Sigh.
I don’t know about jew jew – but I read that some of his family had died tragically – maybe these stories get twisted. I don’t know but it seems a fact that he was allowed compassionate leave and I think his brother died recently. That said – I wouldn’t be too keen on taking this troubled soul in – Balotelli and Liverpool spring to mind.
players to keep for villa next season
keepers
guzan sorry not good enough needs a change of club too long under lambert confidence shot ,another his stats say he is 6 4 to me he looks about 6 foot tall need a keeper 6f 3/4 i
given stay just because his contract as number 2
steer stay no point swapping for any one else
full backs
hutton awful player ,just because he trys doesn t make him any good 11 bookings in 30 odd appearances a liability
bacuna keep him like to see him play wide right
lowton sell typical young player believed his own hype after wonder goal against stoke all down hill since pity
sissko can t understand what shappened to him done well upto sherwood took over would keep him
bennet sell like most lamberts buys only suited to championship
luna ditto
vlar release him no good giving 3 year contract to some one who can only manage to be fit for 2/3 of season
clark cut out silly bookings captain material keep
senderous joke of player out now
okore needs to get fit looked ok along clark keep
baker last chance saloon too injury prone glass man keep but has to stay fit or sell on
sanchez has to get fitter keep
westwood sorry notpremier ship level too small in my eyes for this level sell on
delph poor yesterday has to find position in team keep
cleverly thought we had good player last 3 performances back to normal not worth big contract
benteke need decision now on what he wants if he goes we have to change entire way of playing would like to keep him with extend contract
gabby go now shocking last 4 matches missed sitters in 3 yesterday came on as sub didnt know he was there apart from one run when definitly free maybe pen not good enough leech on high wages
grealish will learn from yesterday keep him
wiemen suffered from been lamberts pet didnt help himself needs to move on
kozak what is about injuries and villa medics how anyone can miss 18 months with broken leg sell on
most of rest can move on sherwood has massive summer if he stays needs major money and if he doesn t get why would he stay
Read an article yesterday on famous fans and Zeph gets 14,000 hits on his FB page compared to Nick Hornby who gets 7,000 but that was enough to get him the vote.
Kevin Costner above Tom Hanks
Sabbath above JZZZZZZ ???
Ed Miliband above Camoron
Wills above Ginger.
etc you know, the sort of tripe the papers love.
I still can’t get over how good Aresenal were. Sanchez , Cazola = dynamite. Someone said on TS this morning it was more like an exhibition match than a cup final – and it had that air about it. It must have shocked TS and our players too. Being on the receiving end on that for the first 20 mins is going to give most teams a wobble. Even Theo said that this is the best Arsenal team he can remember and I think he is right. If they hold onto their best players I can see them storming the league next season.
James G,
We haven’t done all that well out of Next Gen have we ? They reckon Daniel Johnson has been great at PNE, bloody Lambert. Talking of who, he was on TV / Radio on Friday telling everyone how he would set Villa up for the final etc, beyond nerve, bordering insanity.
steamer
lambert must set them up cause we played as if was in charge, when we got the ball sideways back or lump up to benteke with no hope benteke getting it,westwood passed one back to given from inside aresnal half, we had 2 midfieldes booked at half time plus hutton so halftime sherwood should changed some of them i know zog did nothing but what did cleverly do apart from hack aresnal player down early
where is sissko
Andrew P.
Great to see you and John,sorry it was so brief.I only get to see you at funerals,and that must have been an omen,as as fterwards there was a funereal atmosphere amongst our fans.Good to catch up with Fast Eddie too.
I agree Jenny,TS was speaking like a fan,emotional and disappointed.However that said,for too long have many of these players been defended and seperated from a sense of responsibility.There is a losers mentality at the club,we have been on the verge of relegation for years now.Vlaar appears bulletproof,but IMO he is as much a part of our decline as anyone else.
Yesterday`s biggest disappointment was that we didn`t make a game of it and lose 3-2 in a thriller.In reality the game was like a testamonial for Arsenal,versus a non league side.
Although disappointing it wasn`t a suprising performance,we have been awful for years now,from top to bottom.Sherwood is right to show many of them the door,for too long,too many have been taking money under false pretences.
Jenny: ‘ ” For team building and leadership excellence though – more we and less I is better. If he had said we “need more winning mentality” rather than “they have a losing mentality” is is IMO far better as it allows improvement whereas the label “losing mentality” is too static. ‘
I can’t argue with you on that (nor want to!), Jenny, but I was simply making the point that (in different words) that TS doesn’t regard this team as his own (and a lot of whom he’d rather not have there) and that when he does get his own lot together we should expect that his language *will* be different.
Under those circumstances and in the situation that he found himself I’m willing to forgive TS anything just now – next season on is a different kettle of fish.
James – re: Gabby,
I honestly don’t know what you were watching but he was the only one after he came on that was trying to inject life into the team. In the 30 or so minutes he was on I saw him get involved usefully on 3 or 4 occasions apart from the “pen” incident.
JL,
Adopted Brummies them am.
B6B,
Hello mate, did St75 clean up the 20 quids again ?
Did you recognise Fast Eddy ?
Some very nice banners at Wemberlee yesterday which you would expect for a home game.
Nice of the FA to make it a 5-30 KO, Villans got home at 11 – 12 while the Arsenal fans had a twenty minute walk to get their half a bitter in.
Loads of empty seats apparently.
Has anyone else been fined 200,000 for their pitch invasions yet ? why am i not surprised.
Grealish, Gabby and Cissoko were out on the piss last night with a few arsenal players
Good to see they couldn’t give a fuck
Villa fans my arse
Matt Philipps linked to us. Really like him. Out and out winger, would give us good delivery for once for the beast. Sinclair and Phillips out wide is better than playing two number 10’s
If Benteke stays, we either need to play with out and out wingers so he gets service, or we went to keep this diamond, then play someone with sped alongside him. We are useless on his own up top
Players to keep
Benteke (who is gojng to pay £32.5 mill for him – lice in hope )
Okore
Grealish
Baker
Clark
Cleverely
Bacuna
Okore
Sinclair
Richardson
Westwood
Gabby
Gil
Given (no 2)
Guzan if can’t get better
It’s not a bad base to build from – teams have done far better with worse players than those – teams like Swansea , Palace , Stoke finishing top 10 without Benteke class of player . This “You will never play fur the club again ” must be a decision taken away from the emotion of a defeat .
The one player id love to see at AV is Bolassi from Crystal Palace. Also like Bafatimi Gomes from Swansea – who didn’t get off to great start but impressed when I saw him at VP.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/live/2015/may/30/arsenal-v-aston-villa-fa-cup-final-live
On the second photo down there’s a row of miserable looking Asian gents next to Herbert and behind Lerner, they obviously didn’t appreciate the result. Wonder if they’re the buyers, love a good conspiracy theory. Think one’s got a Villa scarf on and anothers yelling “loads of money.”
At least it peed down for the open coach tour around Islington.
Jenny- Richardson ? Really? I’m amazed. I think he’s god awful, Joe Bennett level left back . Baker Given and Guzan I’d ship out also. Both keepers aren’t up to standard anymore. Guzan hasn’t been for 2 years now
You’re right Frem – I didn’t mean to include Richardson – I meant Sinclair who I already included . Guzan is still a ? for me. It’s a case of is there better out there ?
Baker I’d keep for sentimental reasons ie he’s a local Worcester lad and our milkman delivers to his house . I also like his spirit and putting his head on the block mentality – literally at times . Agree he’s not the finished article yet – and he’s not exactly a new player either .
Jenny,
Did you see Bacuna at that 4th goal yesterday?
I was supposed to be marking Giroud but let him slip by to score, during which time Bacuna actually *walked away* from the danger zone, putting his hands in the air as though it was someone else’s fault.
I suspect that several of the players you list – including Bacuna – will get the heave-ho as they won’t stand up and be counted. And that includes Gil, I suspect, otherwise why has he been left out?
Cleverley I’m not sure about after yesterday, and last week too.
Despite what Frem says, but also recognising he has had quite a bit of injury absence, I’d also keep Baker, to see how he goes for another season at least.
No … “I” wasn’t supposed to be marking Giroud – Bacuna was! 🙂
John re Bacuna – I have always thought he’s better in midfield than in defence but has been swapped around by Lambert and now Sherwood . I still think he’s got potential – is relatively cheap and worth a try as a defensive mid as he’s got a good free kick and shot on him too. He’s strong and athletic – one for the squad maybe .
Gil looks like it’s a personality clash if rumours to be believed – even Ian Taylor was raving about him when he played some good games for us ( on par with JG current standard )
Sinclair can do it when Tim’s game plan works – hence the 4 goals in 4 games . He’s proven talent and seems to have good attitude . I’d stick with him. Yesterday is not a game to hire and fire on – they all fell short dudnt they . Even Benteke was unable to shine .
Jenny,
Yes, Bacuna is a creative player, no doubt. But is he really Premiership material?
Unless he was successfully converted into a wing-back I don’t think he has enough. That’s just my opinion. But the issue is we do need players of sufficient ability just to get into the squad and I count Bacuna only as a ‘maybe’. Perhaps keep him for one season to see how he progresses.
Good thoughts all round…
Jenny, I’ve noticed the same thing. I’ve winced more than once at the frequency of “I”. And while Sherwood was gutted, and embarrassed, one hopes that it isn’t a case of blame-shifting. Big egos can be useful, but obviously they’re also dangerous. As you and JL are saying, I don’t see how he can distance himself quite so much if it’s a team of his own making.
You never really know what goes on…Was TS naive for giving it a go? Or did he just think that if we sat back, we’d have broken down to the same end result, and been criticized for negative tactics that made Villa look small?
What I do like is that he seems to be looking for tough-minded players with a commitment to fitness, ie, the ability to give it all week in and week out.
Anyone who knows me will remember over the years I’ve often apportioned as much if not more blame to the players than the managers, as each successive manager after MON has had to try and make the best of what was bought and had one hand tied behind their backs due to the contracts and wages. To make up numbers and try a bottom-up approach to infuse new life, Lambert, for example, really didn’t have any choice but to go with a lot of “young and hungry”. By the same token, he didn’t make much use of the “young” that he already had at his disposal. Ego? Wanting to make his own mark?
He seemed to have the same idea, without saying it, that a number of players were surplus to requirements, hence the bomb squad.
That’s not to say McLeish was progressive. But he would’ve tried what many suggest in retrospect, which was to sit back, smother and counter, something that rankled many.
And to be fair, the idea of a “losing mentality”, “lack of confidence” or some such is not exclusive to Villa. Arsenal, for example, had been growing in reputation as a team that bottles it. City can’t seem to find the requisite steel to get stuck in and see out all the games they should win, especially on the road. I’ve long found them gutless, tbh.
What you want is “accountable” players, the sort who hate losing and take it personally, and take it on themselves to do something about it. I think Vlaar or someone talked about taking more “responsibility” as part of what had been changing, and that’s what TS is getting at, I think.
Jenny: Yesterday is not a game to hire and fire on – they all fell short dudnt they .
Yep. So maybe TS should get rid of the lot!!! … With the exception of about 3.
There’s too much ‘niceness’ about a lot of players in the team and I think that’s what TS is up against. He wants winners, but we only have 2 or 3 in the side who you can really say are ‘up for it’.
JC and Jenny,
So if we are talking about “winners” that we have, I’d list them as…
Okore, Vlaar (but he does make some stinkers), Delph, Baker, Clark and Gabby (despite his foibles).
… believing that CB will go now.
So that’s an awful lot of winners that TS has to find!
Jenny: “Gil looks like it’s a personality clash if rumours to be believed”
Yes, but what about? I believe it’s to do with a character issue … back to this “winner” theme I think.
JL,
I think that’s been the problem, whichever manager needing to find a number of “winners” at any given time. There’s been a merry-go-round of players, but not any foundation that’s really been established.
I think Okore will be fine, as will Clark and Baker (if he can stay fit). The FBs really have been an issue for years, but it’s probably the toughest position to recruit for in the modern game, great defenders who also get forward and put it good balls, overlaps, etc.
If CB were to stay (which, he might well want out now, but suitors may have some second thoughts), we need to find someone to play off of him, a quick player with great feet that helps spread the attention and is a legitimate goal threat that can create moments of magic. Gabby certainly is the current idea there, but he’s not good/creative enough in possession. He does help cause problems, though, and pull attention away from Benteke.
If this £32m fee is correct, and CB does go and TS does get to spend the money, along with a typical kitty of £15m-£20m, then we could do some decent rebuilding. Naturally, though, we’ll have to spend a decent chunk of that on someone who can score regularly.
Oh, and one last thought about tactics before I have to run…
TS’s style seems to have been to get the side out of the gates quickly, establish momentum and impose themselves early. Flood forward while fresh, create opportunities and goals, and then play more on the break. Basically hit teams while they’re a bit shell-shocked and haven’t found their rhythm.
Arsenal weren’t about to let us do that yesterday. And neither were Soton. I think the lack of plan B is part lack of a viable plan B, and also the idea that you have to persist with the one positive line-up/plan A you do have, and at least be good at that, figure the odds will favor you enough for taking the initiative and looking for goals.
JL: “so if we are talking about ‘winners’ that we have, I’d list them as…
Okore, Vlaar, Delph, Baker, Clark and Gabby”.
Only trouble is those winners haven’t actually won very much. I can’t be bothered to check but I think Vlaar may have won a title or two in Holland and Gabby’s won a couple of fivers on lottery scratch cards, and that’s about it. Time to rip it up and start again.
It does sound like CB will be off. Can’t blame him one bit ( Just don’t go to Liverpool or Spurs )
I can imagine TS is amazed at the level our players accept defeats. That’s what they have been use to for years under Lambert. He never pushed our players to win. It’s got to the stage where losing is expected and then accepted by players when it happens. The big teams fail when they lose, and simply do what is required when they win. When they walk of pitch after losing, they feel like they’ve failed. When our bunch walk of a pitch after losing, they don’t feel like they’ve failed. They just accept that what’s was expected
Winning should never be a bonus. It should be expected. It should be a way of life to footballer. They’ve failed if they haven’t won. That’s what it has been like for 3 seasons, a surprise, a little bonus
Imagine if special forces soldiers had our teams mentality. They train over and over again. Footballers train over and again. There are 8 hostages. Do they go in with the mentality that if all 8 are killed then that’s fine? They are paid to train and save life’s, but still it’s fine. Or do they go in with the mentality that anything less than al l coming out alive is a failure ?
Our players are paid to train also. They should have the mentality that anything las than 3 points is a failure. We haven’t had that for years, and that’s what Sherwood needs to change this summer with ah big overhaul
Well yesterday was a real laugh up until 1730, then the match ruined a decent day on the lash. We were on the smash from 0900-0300( there were some still going when we left). TS got it wrong again yesterday and we got thumped, the players and manager let the fans down badly and TS must now know what a massive task he has to overhaul this pathetic squad Lambert built. Only time will tell if TS is up to it and his report card will read shit or shine so far, but he has earned the right having kept us up( through hull being shite) to bring in his own signings. I’m glad it’s all over for a while, although the summer transfer circus will start very soon.
Andrew P: “Only trouble is those winners haven’t actually won very much.”
No, Andrew, we’re not talking *literally* about winners … but about winners in character … players that say to themselves, “right, roll-up sleeves time” … and make their presence felt – fairly of course!
You know, as Ron Saunders used to say: “I have a team full of captains”. Players that pick up the cape of responsibility.
Apparently CB did an interview for Belgian media last week and said he’d be away if Villa didn’t win the cup.
Des Bremner was that type wasn’t he John ?
When TS talks about winners i hope he doesn’t mean ex Spurs reserves, they don’t win much.
Hopefully the club will be sold in the next couple of weeks and we can forget the Lerner nightmare, still can’t make my mind up who is the worse Herbie or Loser, probably Herbie.
You still find the odd delusion idiot seeking sainthood who defends them, isn’t life strange ?
Sorry JL, I was being flippant but I don’t see most of them as winners metaphorically either. If they were we wouldn’t be such a soft touch.
Hello folks
Yesterday was pretty much what I feared, we have been found out. press us high up the field shutting off westwood and meanwhile the rest of the midfield has charged up field to join the attack that never happened. We become totally disjointed as a team and there is our problem. Rather than call them winners I would say we need players who can grab the team and organise it on the fly, not blindly carry out a plan that’s not working. Senderos did this for a short while and the comments from the other players on his organizational skills were painful to hear. Made me think you lot don’t know how to think for yourselves. So far it hasn’t mattered who’s in charge of the team the eventual result is the same, a few good results then collapse as the games up.
watching the old Saunders team I never thought oh we are a defensive or counter attack type team, we did it all well something this lot seem incapable of grasping.
On Bacuna the lad is a central midfielder similar to delph or cleverly but has a better eye for a pass than both. the lad has played out wide because no-one bar lowton can cross and he has a motor, If Cleverly goes I’d play him there.
Andrew P,
Of those I’ve listed you could only play 4 of the 6 at one time. Or maybe 5.
That number obviously doesn’t make a team, especially when the other 5 (outfielders) don’t measure up, so the fact that we don’t have enough such players shows why we buckle.
Grealish over the past 3 matches has been a luxury as he has seemed to be out of his depth. Still needs a lot of experience. And Zoggy also has been carried of late, while Cleverley has been found out.
Mark,
Good point on Bacuna – but he does need to sharpen up some more.
Steamer – as you and Mark intimate, Saunders knew how to put a working *team* together, and Bremner was certainly the working cog.
Andy grays son –
So another season done, more downs than ups but not without some special moments. Big Summer ahead with big changes afoot & I can’t wait! i’m fortunate to know some people who know some people, but nothing certain till its certain.
Apparently one USA mob and one Chinese, i’m in favour of the Chinese especially if its Dalian but i’m pretty certain Lerner will go USA,if the rumours are true.
john l
not looking for a row but gabby is past it not worthy of a shirt no more sorry ,and no i watched match can t remember gabby doing anything apart from one run yes should been either free or pen that was it ,got booked for mouthing, houiller found him out 5 years ago ,keane cottoned on to the bluffer after 6 weeks,
fox has a lot to answer for his mad month september new contract for our two worst players hutton gabby and definitly manager lambert
I haven’t seen us knocked off the ball so easily as Arsenal did yesterday . It’s all very well going out to attack but I didn’t feel we even did that . Was there a plan as all I saw was Arsenal making wonderful moves and passing and us looking shell shocked. Maybe it was too subtle for me
On the subject of winners – couldn’t agree more . But as Mark said , we need captains – love the quote from Ron Saunders – thanks fir posting this. To some extent the “winning mentality ” will be inspired by the manager – Clive Woodward did this for the English rugby team but it dudnt work in his stint in football – another debate ie spoilt over payed footballers – the baby Bentley crew we are stuck with . You get the impression that players like Sanchez – who must be dead on his feet having played every single game, are rare to find . I don’t mean just his talent but his grit and commitment. He’s a fighter until the end , as he had to be just to survive his up bringing .
Who was there to round up the groups yesterday – I didn’t notice either Vlaar or Delph being particularly vocal .
I’d also agree with Mark on Sendeross (punch myself I’ve agreed with Mark twice !). He showed passion and great leadership skills at the beginning of the season .
Evening
The result was a bit of a wounder yesterday. Not the biggest shock of the season, perhaps that was escaping relegation.
Great day, great fans lots of fun.
Think it all went wrong when we failed to get the happy birthday to Stevie song going in the 35th minute.
Just for the record i have never seen Andrew P drink more than three pints aside from one time in Bocum when he fell over like he had been shot whilst squealing like a pig, then spent the next two months walking around with a pimp limp.
Dont have to worry about football for a couple of weeks now any way – all changes at the club this summer must be seen as a good thing after the last four years.
Renewed my season ticket today.
Pinch myself not punch Haha
Steamer- he seems pretty on sure twitter doesn’t he. He seems a good guy to. Villa fan himself. Hope something happens soon, but I’d fear for Sherwood after our last 3 results. I’d hate a new manager now.
Jenny- not sure what the A plan was. I hate it when managers over complicate football. Lambert did it, Sherwood is a bit. The 4312 has been great at times, but we need more than just that. We need to master at least 2 formations this pre season, maybe more
I don’t get why managers don’t play with width. Why play 3 narrow centre mids with little pace ? Then play 3 forwards with no pace ? How do you expect to cause problems ?
Wembley and Villa park are big pitches. Why stand in each other’s toes then? I hate full backs trying to provide the width. Hate it. They are full backs for a reason. They failed trying to be an attacker. You don’t need to crowd the centre of the pitch every second. Wingers can tuck in to defend. We need at him especially to sign wingers who will stand right out on the touch line. Matt Phillips would be a great start
Width width width
JL so you’re talking about the backbone of the side that was dicked by Southampton a couple of weeks ago. We lack quality and we haven’t got enough fight in the squad to make up for it.
Evening chuckles. Good news about your season ticket.
Jen I’ll buy you a medal to commemorate the moment 🙂
What i saw yesterday was arsenal hunting the ball in 3’s even with gealishs skill you need outlets or you lose the ball. We dont do this, you see individuals running between players like headless chickens thats hard work to keep up. We lack team work and when we are stopped from moving the ball quickly we fall apart.
Yes I can see the wisdom in that Frem . For the life of me I don’t know why they always pass to crowded out areas – all bunched up together – wound round each other’s legs like a bunch of Jack Russell’s in a fight . Why can’t they do what we do in netball “find some space – get free “.!!!!!
Mark – I will be reviewing my meds if this continues
Arsenal did hunt us down – and it worked . What do you do to get round this as watching it unfold I couldn’t come up with any solution either !
Andy grays son is in the know as much as anyone who reads a paper……chinease or americans been talked about for weeks!
Nice break from footy now and the stresses of being a villa fan. Lets re charge the batteries and do it all again next season
Peace out everyone x
Jen for me you have to get closer and provide outlets at least 2 at a time . we tend get on our bike even when its not working. The result is the man on the ball gets swamped. Its poor really from pros
Benteke every where in the press. We will offer him 75 grand a week. Isn’t gabby on 60?
well thank fuck that seasons over ,
had a great day all be it the score but to be honest l didnt expect any different , they never showed up , lest see what happens during the summer ,
met up with brasil again and also Met Andrew P and his clan , all the best lads ,
although the game was shit what really disapoints me now at villa games are the little twats trying to make a name for themselves by fighting other villa fans , fucking idiots , yes l had one of these twats try it during the game , a 7year old couldnt see the game because this knuckle dragger wouldnt sit down , l said to him , l dont mind getting thrown out as the games lost and shit so if you want to take it further , lets go ,
this isnt new , we’ve noticed the little twats in the Aston Social looking for US to try and make a name for themselves , but this is the game now , and although were all hitting 60+ it will take more than some of them idiots , spoiled the day , and see it all in the papers now , what a joke at Kilburn Station as well , most was villa Vs villa , bring back the birch , lets see how hard they are when squealing for their mommy’s .
well have a nice summer all , got ot give my liver and kidneys a break ,
Frem whats happened mate , l sorted info about them questions and never heard back , did you get it sorted , and got steamers to test if you still want to do it .
morning jenny xxxx
Andrew P: “so you’re talking about the backbone of the side that was dicked by Southampton a couple of weeks ago.”
You’ll recall that the c-bs (particularly Okore) were carrying injuries and that has been a big problem for TS … what he’s done when having a barebones squad to pick from on occasions is bloomin good.
We’ve missed Clark i.m.o. – there were times this season when he showed how it should be done and stuck his chest out with pride. Captain material without doubt.
Mark/Jenny
The only outlets some of our players look interested in are the fashion and jewlery variety:) You’re right though, our players were getting swamped and often lacked support. I think the boozer, by the sound of it, is for a few of them their real outlet. Don’t mind a couple of pints after a match, but if I’m paying 60000 quid a week to someone that’s all I’d tolerate. It should be written into their contracts imo.
Frem
Gabby’s fortunate to get 60,000 a week. Benteke deserves more because his goals saved Villa from relegation. Even Ginger (rightly) said that Gabby needs to find a few new tricks. Could he become a genuine winger? He’s been a bit of a sickbay ranger these past few years. Too many sprints down the sideline might be too much for him. Will he trace back in defence adquately? He’d get plenty more chances to use his speed.
If CB goes, hope he goes to Chelsea or Arsenal.
‘I always used to say to him, ‘give me one more year, one more year’ and he was great with it and I’m delighted he’s turning out to be the player I always thought he could be.’
Wonderful Paul, one out of thirty isn’t bad is it ? Why do the papers chase this knob for quotes, it only makes him feel important rather than the biggest moron in the history of football management.
Read more: http://metro.co.uk/2015/06/01/paul-lambert-shocked-by-latest-development-in-liverpools-transfer-hunt-for-aston-villa-striker-christian-benteke-5222046/#ixzz3bnSPlMA4
As far as players we should keep maybe we should be asking which of our players could operate in a better team? vlaars done it with Holland, Sinclair with Swansea, delph could step up, Clarke imo could. Benteke already has with belgium and okore could imo, Baker solid but limited (but definitely improving) clevrleys a strange one as he did OK at manure but then sank. Grealish with better players around him would be amazing too. Gardner has stood out in a championship side but I’d bet my house he could fit in a better side. sanchez suits a latin style so I’d give him a go but I don’t think he’s suited to a defensive 2 in midfield.
It might anger some but I think you could put westwood in that arsenal side and he’d fit in with there style of play. Gil would look fine in 95% of the prems teams imo.
right then who wouldn’t, None of our fullbacks unless Bennetts improved vastly. gabby as JL says brings something but as a striker is limited (poor in front of goal for all his speed). Weimann no, Nzogbia I’m afraid should be shot for wasting potential. none of our keepers would get into a top team.
Now just because they could operate in a better team doesn’t make them world class more like they could fill a role. In our team most are asked to do more than they are capable as the team play aspect is missing most games. Is this the managers fault? partly as he picks the players but also he’s limited by them too. To me what we are lacking is players with know how to gel the team together, we have too many usable parts and not enough operating system to make those parts work together. Can it be coached? not entirely I believe, some have it some don’t, we need desperately to find some that have this summer.
trin- Its like watching NZ play rugby v England’s style. the making of runs and there timing is crucial, the Kiwis are almost always there, Englands to early or late with little momentum, how they make it to the bar I don’t know 😉
Steamer I bet Lambert played this in his office on a loop
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-b3XTj5G_SA
Mark,
Look at Gabby’s assets, skill – no, brains – no, heading – no, effort – no, finishing – no, pace – diminshing, bank balace for doing f-all – massive. Total waste of space, chases the odd stupid pass to con the fans that he’s trying, shyster.
That’s the only decent song i’ve ever heard from the ESC, nice tune and the saxophone is great.
they do music? thought it was part of the EEC’s voting system
Strange that the FA condemn the Villa’s late kick off in the Olbyon cup game but then change the CF to 5-30, what happened to the sensible drinking hours ?
Jon Moss ? Everyone knew he was crepe and he demonstrated exactly why we held that opinion, just how many Wemberlee games are these winkers gonna cost us ? If he had done his job and we scored those two penalties we’d have had, however unjustified, a 3-2 game and Villa on the front foot. And the FA slate Blatter for being corrupt, kettle and pot in my book.
Steamer – your stirring up a hornets nest there!
I was in front of the villa fans who had their hand bag moment – totally down to little boys who couldnt handle their drink combined with a poor display on the pitch.
Late KO was a pain especially for many getting home. The ref did give us nothing all day (again). To my mind football needs two refs on the field as in Basketball so there is always one behind the play and one in front. The bonus is yo also begin to take the ego out of the officials as there is then a team of them in charge not just one donut, more of a selection of donuts…..
On another not if benteke goes to chelses he will at least be gone quickly – dont they like to do business early in the window?
Steamer I think nothing has been made of it as we were poor on the day
but both were fouls and in gabbys case if it wasn’t then its a dive, both could of produced a different outcome to the game. That said did you see Grealish kick the Arsenal players legs away when they broke to score the 4th? happened at the half way and he could of walked for it, probably a reaction to the penalty decision.
Surely Tim would have been better served packing the midfield especially when we where 10 – 0 down og aggregate over the previous 2 games
sunderland ect showed how you frustrate the gooners but ts decided we could go out and out score them —Not
Steamer those chinese guys sitting with randy looked far from impressed in that photo
Major work needed — if we have 30mil to spend expect another relegation battle
Bibulus if he has to go to a prem team then please make it Chelsea. don’t want to help the bindippers or arse.
runtingz yes it was puzzling, and why did nzogbia start? when he offers no protection to the fullback. Almost as worrying is Benteke has stopped moving again since the wet spam game and is stood waiting for hopeful punts or crosses.
painful piss take
http://newsthump.com/2015/06/01/aston-villa-stayed-behind-at-wembley-to-enjoy-shot-on-target/?
Always thought Zog had talent but, unfortunately no heart – out. You can usually tell how he’s going to play by the first 15 minutes, so TS should have removed him.
Going through the blogs its amazing how many accepted the defeat as foregone, like the players. Sorry, but when i played you’d keep battling away for the entire game. Accepted that most of our team is crepe but when the fans accept regular humiliations without a murmer then you realise the mindset that Lerner has instilled in AVFC, TS is correct but its not only the players who need to accept that to be associated with Aston Villa is an honour, whatever happened to fight like lions ?
Runtingz,
Lets hope it was the Chinese representatives of Dalian, as i said, i like a conspiracy theory but why would a row close to Lerner and Herbert be full of what looked like Chinese businessmen ?
Talking of Herbert, i wonder if he was as disappointed as the REAL Villa fans were.
Mark – i think tekkers was very frustrated as the wenger did his homework and staved him of the main way we supply him
tacticall wenger set his boys up to nullify us and control the game – Tim did everything wrong and didnt seem to plan for to stop them
on such a big day for the club i find his approach shocking
TS was the right man to keep us up but he has a lot too learn if he wants to make villa an actual success
Bibulus .
quite a few pics on my facebook with the fans fighting each other ,
also you know a lot of people were after tickets , 15 youths who couldnt get tickets and they never tried as when they got to wembley they doubled up at the turnstile and 6 of those jumped the barrier , but the 5-30 kick-off didnt help ,l watched groups of the youths walking up the Kilburn high street and most were out of it , but if you got 4/5 hours to kill what did the FA expect , and it comes to something when the Falkirk vs motherwell has preference over the Elite , sky have more say than our spineless FA, and can you see these chumps boycotting the world cup , sky wont let them ,
been in touch with Ged , that charity do he has At the cider mill in Evesham will be in August so as soon as l get the date l will flag up on here , if you still want to do that meet-up , and just to let you know it is child friendly so if you feel you want to bring the kids along feel free , helps me out as l have to bring Steamer , they had Tombola, raffles, skittles and other side show things and the bands , and if we dont end up strangling each other we could do one in worcs,
does anyone think the £75,000 being offered to Benteke will be enough to keep him ,,,,,got to be honest – l dont but we live in hope , well lm off now to spend my lottery win , just need another £3 to get a cider put in with the blackcurrant ,…… enjoy your Hols
would of liked to see Bacuna start instead of Nzogbia, would of made more sense. if you watch him in these clips he does a great impression of a tree while Mutton gets the run-around from Sanchez and walcott
http://www.just-football.com/2015/06/watch-fa-cup-final-highlights-arsenal-4-0-aston-villa/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Just-football+%28Just-Football%29
nice too see tekker thoughts on the villa site saying we must get over it and move on and how gutted he was for the fans — maybe villa is in his heart as much as jack’s and fabs
ST75 is that £75,000 a one off payment?
ST75:“does anyone think the £75,000 being offered to Benteke will be enough to keep him ”
Well, it’s also to do with who is going to stump up the minimum £32.5m … the press seem to think that Liverpool will, but they are also talking to Ings. I don’t think they’d want to buy both.
See http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/may/31/tim-sherwood-christian-benteke-aston-villa
well what can i say went sat and was disgusted with the attitude of the whole team but most with the manager why did he not start t the semi final team start Hutton is sorry useless cannot cross a ball to save his life his subs should have been made at half time not when the second goal went in and that was match over as for the players they were simply chasing shadows all game delph gave the ball away every time he had it cleverley was out classed and jack just crumbled under the pressure but he kept trying and should have been sent off in the last minute as he just lashed out
But the ref did not help things he was completely bent from the first minute to the last and we should have had 1 pen and either a free kick on edge of box or another pen as bad as we were those decisions where piss poor as for who goes and who stays we all have different opinions so we have to wait to see is the club is sold or not we have in my eyes 9 players who i would keep out of 25 the rest boot out the door with gabby as the leader bring all the young players in and give them a go with 5 10 mill signings at least if that does not happen the same crap will carry on
next season give Tim a chance to see what he can do .
but if we are sold a new owner might want a new manager as there is a rumour that the carnival guy might buy us and bring in the gerrman as manager and that was from people who work on the cruise line which i have just finished last week Alaska is a beautiful place how are you steamer and i bet the blue scum where happy in the club at the weekend
Benteke wants Europe then. 32.5 mill please. And we are offering Vlaar a new deal. I’m getting extremely sick with Villa. Selling our best players, keeping ones who are declining and signing crap
another thing wrong on sat was that they should have sung Abide with Me after the game as that is how most of us felt singing about death
ST75- Hi mate. I sorted the questions out thanks. I’ll hand the assignment in on Weds and see how it goes. I’ll speak to my manager tomoz about the testing. He’s been away, spand we have a company on site installing now so maybe he might put with me them for a bit but I’ll see
JD,
How’s it going mate ? Still optimistic about a take over, the alternative doesn’t bear thinking about, but i hope Lerner doesn’t choose Arison over Dalian, but you know Lerner and the distrust that the USA has for foreigners. Felt like kicking the TV in when the smarmy git started laughing, the sooner him and Fox piss off the better.
thought the Villa were a total embarrassment, if we go into a final with that attitude then why enter in the first place, if the opposition have better players then work harder don’t hold up a white flag, too many gutless wonders.
Well said John Doyle – that’s how i am feeling today about the whole thing.
Dafabet Slumberlands new sponsor, wonder if we’ll get a new one?
Steamer I think we have a deal with Pampers
Steamer: ” Still optimistic about a take over, the alternative doesn’t bear thinking about”
I’m not too sure about that. Everyone was eager to get Doug out in 2006 but then what happened?
j
”I’m not too sure about that. Everyone was eager to get Doug out in 2006 but then what happened?”
We finished in the top 6 three times on the spin
i will take that again but with proper football people making the decisions this time
Runtings,
I think you know what I mean … my comment was about the people running the club – or thought they were but MON had his own ideas.
JL it wasnt a dig – for a change 🙂
One thing is sure though – we won’t get away with operating the way we are too much longer
I had even less confidence in Herbert than i do in Lerner John, don’t forget who turned down Sheik Mansour for Lerner.
Did anyone else think Given could of done better?(or Guzan) I have watched the goals/shots several times and if they were not within easy reach his reactions seemed slow or at least off? Fair play he made some good saves but but barely twitched for some. Sanchez’s shot was a rocket but I’ve seen those tipped over, Given appeared to jump but did not get as high as the crossbar. Also the headed goal was no more than 3 foot from him and he was flat footed. The last one beat him at the near post but shit happens. we didn’t deserve much on the day but these small things matter.
I agree with you about Give Mark. 10 conceded in last 2 games. Wouldn’t even keep him as cover. Is Guzan any better? Probably, but it’s bit like arguing about who was the best singer in the Spice Girls.
frem
ok mate , good luck
andrew p, know what you mean, shorty or baldy spice
Bent will go. Wiemann sounds like he will piss off. That’s over 100 grand of the wages to put on Benteke. If he goes, that’s leaves Kosak and Gabby. Oh dear. Strike force overhaul needed , and keepers, and defence, and midfield
i think guzan is the best of of a bad bunch
i see liverpoo fans tolling tekkers on twitter after the final saying stuff like – worse than heskey (but with worse spelling than me – is that possible)
another was what is worse 30mil teks 20 mil loveren or 38mil carrol – those pool fans sure know there footy 🙂
i guess that would be the last place he would want to go now – so thanks for than bin dippers
thanks for that
Nice one MK. I’d go for baldy. We could play both and we still wouldn’t have a good keeper. That said, 0-4 on Saturday flattered us.
Stats fans, our second choice “striker”, Gabby Agbonlahor, has now managed the grand total of 27 goals in the past 5 seasons. One more than Sergio Aguero scored last season.
wonder what TS is thinking seeing as he played Steer in preference to Guzan? Hardly shouts your my number 1 Brad does it? you’d of thought he’d of said prove yourself against Burnley and your in contention for the cup final, not feck off I prefer shorty spice and the ranchhand. Puzzling and when you add Gil to the mix you have to hope TS is not starting an Ego war.
Agree with Andrew P, not only was Sanchez’s goal not the best ever scored in a CF, it was a dud, Given should have saved it easily.
Mark,
Given may not have recovered for the final, if Guz had been injured vs Burnley Steer would have had to play in the CF.
Its his way or no-way which is only right, but IMO the way he’s treated Gil is out of order, the lad did really well in most of his games, certainly better than half a dozen you could name but has been insulted and unfairly treated, i think less of TS because of it and although it might seem harsh it brings back memories of Lambert, Karsa and Culverarse.
Lambert still has the knack of making himself look like an amateur
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/01/lambert-reveals-three-top-clubs-he-has-spent-time-at-since-villa/?
MK, particularly so as Jed Steer had already played for Yeovil in FA Cup so was cup-tied. I’d be surprised if we don’t see a new first choice keeper next season.
Runtingz,
Shows how bad Pool are then, he always rips them apart. Messie would have struggled with that supply.
“The good thing about spending time with the three managers – Carlo Ancelotti, Pep Guardiola and Klopp – is that they’re probably the three biggest names out there at the minute in world football.
Yes Paul two of them have been booted, just like you were, name dropping gobshite.
I know Steamer but why risk Vlaar, benteke, Grealish? you get the point. similarly if Gil is staying or going what harm in playing him? why have a bench full of kids? whatever has gone on must be massive because TS couldn’t surely have watched all our games and not noticed his Quality or impact, Its the white elephant in the room riding on a brontosaurus
Re Gil
this is the trouble with old school managers – if they don’t get on with you then your ability doesnt matter as they will point too a poor attitude and get shot
not the way foward in the modern game is it
players are rich and spoilt and sometimes difficult to deal with but you need to be able to adapt and get the best out of your better player which are the tools for any success for the club
my boy was at chelski and palace and still see’s the palace lads he played with regularly — he comes back telling me about the unbelievable places they live in and was ridding around with a palace lad in his lamborghini the other week —– the guy driving is 22yrs old —— there is no point trying to bully rich kids into anything as they just wont care
Steamer not one word he says makes sense beyond the bleeding obvious
Runtingz, that’s why it makes even less sense for me because Gil doesn’t strike me as the type to rock the boat. Maybe he was given assurances by Lambert he’d play? he then found himself in a poor team with a weird manager. TS not giving him a go would be hard to take on top of that.
As you say, it must be personal because he’d have played him vs Burnley to save his CF team.
Definitely a dark side.
Evening all and ST75x
Gil and Weiman have been given their marching orders – the clear your locker time has started .
Well seeing photos of Grealish and Gabby coming out of the Libertine Club at 6 am Sunday morning with the Arsenal players just served to remind me that players aren’t fans – oh but gabby and Jack bleed claret and blue don’t they . Ok so they deserve to celebrate , but when their loyal fans have out in so much to get to Wenbley, finance and travel wise and have been delighted with not one shot on target – maybe celebrating with the team who have just stuffed you isn’t the most diplomatic .
Benteke wants £150 k a week apparently so doubt £75k a week won’t be tempting enough . He will think he can get more elsewhere – and it wouldn’t surprise me if Chelsea come in for him.
Obviously the “they deserve to celebrate ” refers to the end if their season – not the Wenbley shambles !
Jenny, what were Gabby and jigsaw celebrating? I think that’s outrageous. Maybe Sanchez and Giroud were drawing diagrams for them on beer mats and giving them a beginners course in goal scoring. Do they even have beer mats in the Libertine Club?
You’d expect Gabby because he’s thick. JG’s old man won’t be happy and neither will TS. I said a couple of years ago, its them and us, well they ain’t getting another penny out of me.
Hey Jen
This is the mentality of the modern footballer
David James made an interesting point about why should a player be a role model – his argument was that once you leave work your life should be yours and you should only be responsible for your being a role model while in the work invioroment
i think its a good point – look at greats like george best and McGrath (booze heads) but they knew how to do there jobs well — Marradonna – charlie head ect
it does look bad but if they aare not at work i guess they should be free to do what they like within reason
he was saying everyone at west ham hated De canio but they still loved his work and the fact he kept them in the prem
It wasn’t the going to a club until 6 am that grated with me – it was the fact they went with the Arsenal players . I hope all the city highlife doesn’t turn Jack’s head like it has past villa hopefuls. They need to take the spot light off him a touch IMO
jen where did you hear about Gil and Weiman? looks like bennett is being given a chance TS likes him
http://www.bha.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=553921
JD was right, Villa sold to Mickey Arison, possible announcement later this week.
GBest and God – brilliant players and I’m not judging them but just wonder if they would have been even more brilliant without the drinking . I don’t think they should drink to excess during the season purely because it affects performance – playing and training. No problem with them getting pissed up when season ends .
Set up by my mate Tom Fox, they were touring VP at the Burnley game.
Worth $7.4B, not for much longer.
steamer he has $7billion so not so bad lets hope he’s not a nob head
Shopping list –
New North Stand
Minimum 8 players including Messi, Ronaldo, Iniesta.
Change name of Witton Lane stand.
Buy the Sty to use as overflow car park for our huge crowds.
My friend texted me – I will ask him where he got it from
Can’t have three in a row.
Jen the 3 runtingz mentioned are definitely not the norm, they were all incredible players, they would be worth £150 mil these days, didn’t really help their longevity in the game.
Can afford to buy up Gabby’s contract, watch out Walsall.
steamer,
knock down the sty and start a football club there
Seems i have a credibility problem…. ITS HAPPENING……… YIPPEEEEEEEE.
jen,
maybe there is a connection between genius and lack of self control?
Inside info – we will have to see what press says then .
You on TBAR again Steamer ? Don’t believe what that site says
We are in a huge mess again. Clev in talks wi Everton
Possibly Mark
Genius and obsessional / focus maybe
As well as Carles Gil, Andreas Weimann and Philippe Senderos, Aly Cissokho, Matthew Lowton, Brad Guzan, Shay Given and Joe Cole, Sherwood is understood to be willing to let Nathan Baker, Kieran Richardson and Alan Hutton leave Villa Park this summer.
Obviously no-one believes me, have a squint at TBAR – Villa Chat – takeover – pages 47 – 49, not happened yet but the evidence is overwhelming, seems it was known in America according to the bloke on the tube.
If he’s going to replace that lot he’ll need some $$$$ IMO this is no bull, Arison was offloading shares last year, done it and wants AVFC now. I’ll bet St75’s 20 quid on it.
jen or love of taking a risk, merson for instance
Thats my £20
Frem, I’m not happy that Wurzel is willing to let Alan ‘Dog Shit’ Hutton to leave Villa Park in the summer. Doggy should be locked away in a little cage under the Holte for crimes against football.
Vlaar not a happy bunny
http://sportwitness.ning.com/forum/topics/it-s-worthless-star-uninterested-in-fa-cup-medal-defies-club-and-
MK, Vlaar can do one as well.
interesting last hour on here, looks like we start the new season with the u21’s and some piss heads with a huge bank balance, should be good then.
Steamer- can’t tell if the guy on TBAR who says he’s in contact with his arsenal mate is genuine or not
Frem,
Its one or two other things from different peeps that convinces me, like the bloke and his kid being told by an American sports writer that something big was going to happen to Villa and today when JD, who has been on a cruise with Arisons company said that he was told by staff on the ship. It seems that quite a few folk over the Atlantic already know. Plus grays lad was positive while others nailed it down to two parties. Even the fact that TS is releasing so many players with experience, they won’t be cheap to replace. Anyway, we’ll possibly know by the end of the week. It seems a little less vague than last year.
Plus Lerner looked a happy bunny on Saturday.
And Gazza of course Mark
Let’s hope the willing bidders didn’t see the Cup final .
Where did you see the queue for the exit door info Frem .
Right, just spoke to him again. He still will not tell me names but he said that his name has been leaked in the past. He said that the deal has been off and on for over a season. It was first to do with FFP and the losses that villa had in their books, then it was down to Lerner. Now apparently everything fits and he has signed on the dotted line. He wouldn’t really give timescales but had said it would happen this week or next. He said that its funny how a lot of players are signing contracts and saying that they will be here next year, it’s because they have known for sometime. He also said that benteke would be mad to leave and thinks that he will be staying.
Plus Delph’s happiness at signing a contract.
I forgot, he also said that this guy hates losing, and will do anything to succeed. Also the players have all met him.
I did ask my friend if it was Ellison and he said “let me ask the oracle” (joke)
Larry Ellison owns Oracle and hes described by the media as – The man who hates to lose: Oracle boss Larry Ellison
$56b
Grealish also said we wouldn’t be disappointed.
And Vlaar now wants to stay.
Perhaps thats why we were crepe on Sat, they knew that TS would boot them if he had money.
It all seems to add up for me.
wonder if he’ll give away cruises instead of scarves? bonus
shit so no free cruises 🙁
Steamer it had occurred to me that some would be fearing for their jobs once we were safe, don’t think it would stop them wanting a meddle though
or medal 🙂
departing player confirmations
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-full-back-set-top-9369499?
steamer it’s the stuff dreams are made of having a owner like that – praying it becomes reality very soon
-amazing times ahead if it all comes throu
it seems great players like great artists have major inperfects as people – especially beng n the public eye were you are constantly judged
i have been around players who are right uo themselves and look down on the less fortunate (n money terms , not happiness btw) and those kinda guys get right up my nose
but if a player does his best in his work enviroment and falls by the way side in his personal lke – i cant dislike him for that
inperfections 🙂
True Runtingz, its not like the rest of society are angels, rock stars are not expected to be, I suppose its the whole performance linked coupled with amounts of money most will never see in a lifetime plus being a fan vs an employee that makes our view of them distorted and them of us.
I wouldn’t judge any of them for their social lives / drinking habits . But there seems a gulf between the likes of Vlaar – who refused to be gagged by the AV PR department and spoke out about his disappointment and frustration with playing so badly , and seeing the others living it up with the Arsenal players . Couldn’t they just hold fire on this for one night because they are adding to the impression that they just don’t care .
mr carnival as the people on his ships call him he also owns P&O plus 6 other cruise lines he paid 1.3 bill for his last ship Britannia plus he has 4 more being build for 6 bill he dont deal in peanuts
the staff on his ship where saying villa park would be Carnival park and we would have carnival on our shirts he wants world wide coverage so we would have to be good
he’s come to the right club if he wants a circus
http://www.fourfourtwo.com/news/bosnich-if-id-listened-terry-i-would-have-avoided-drugs?
Carnival Park , you having a fucking laff , the noses will bloody love that , we been calling them a fucking circus for years , where’s Dr No when you need him , sink his ships . l can just see it now , the new north stand shaped like a bloody ship , just like me dads old 60s Bar we had in the front room , ))
Runtins hope you enjoyed your BBQ mate , quite a few lads asked where you was saturday ,
Andrew P your brother needs to contact Steamer , he has a villa shirt that never made the shops ,
did always wonder who’s sewing machine that was in steamers shed .
steamer
“sore finger” went down a bomb in the chip shops ))
loads of fake tickets at wembley , woody got done , expect bad news in the mail this week as l think someones gonna be hanging from a lamp-post round castle vale ,
think l better get this out as well before steamer ,and dont worry l have broad shoulders , l have been chosen for clinical trials on me head , to be honest l think l need them after spending over £700 on the weekend , best £20 l lost was the one l gave the young girl in the doorway by Maccy Ds , l watched her go in there and buy herself a meal so l knew l wasnt scammed , l do feel for some of these kids on the streets ,
forget Dynamo the magician , brasil takes some beating , lm still waiting on that other £20 to reappear in my wallet mate , think Andrew P was in on it as well ,
is this real or a wind up?
http://www.talkingbaws.com/2015/06/01/video-aston-villa-fan-calls-up-bentekes-agent-pretending-to-be-premier-league-manager/?
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/02/sherwood-describes-potential-obstacle-to-aston-villas-summer-bus/?
Talk of players out celebrating after a non performance like that one on saturday fills me with disgust, end of season drinks after again just avoiding relegation tells you all you need to know about the modern day footballer who have got way too much money and not enough between their ears, its the main reason why genuine football fans are walking away from the game, the prawn sarnie lot can have it and shove it where the sun don”t shine.
Talk of another Yank using Aston Villa as a vehicle to fulfil his own personal ambitions makes me want to vomit, football clubs are now the rich mans play thing and I can see the loss of our identity as one of the last true bastions of English football going down the drain with the promise of millions spent on marque signings.
Unfortunately this is the monster we have created aided and abetted by Sky and all the other media outlets who make billions out of the game, I can only thank god that my time watching the Villa was at a time when money was not the driving factor in the game, some call it progress I have another name for it.
Deano I hope you and the lads had a great day on Saturday taking away the result obviously.
AVFC
SWV,
You and I clearly sing from the same hymn sheet on this, and I’m sure there are many other Villans over-50 (or less) who share these feelings. On the other hand, because following your footie club is ‘in the blood’, perhaps many turn a blind eye to off-the-field issues.
But it’s all symptomatic of the world we live in isn’t it? There’s so much that’s going on in so many spheres that really turn me off. And it’s the realisation that people of fine principles such as the now late Charles Kennedy were admired not so many years ago but now get rejected by previously adoring fans in the name of something-or-other.
It’s also things like what’s happening to the NHS where I’ve now found that the government’s outsourcing policies mean I now have to go to TWO places to get my medication prescriptions yet I still come under one GP.
Madness – commonsense is out of the window.
St75,
60 years too late, does this clinical test involve pulling a pipe cleaner through your ears ?
JL.
Lunatics, Asylum ?
SWV,
Unfortunately, and you know i’m a traditionalist, its either that or oblivion. I’d actually build a new stadium, VP ceased to be VP when the philistine had the Trin Road demolished for that plastic eyesore.
St75,
It was my 20 anyway.
She’ll come looking for you when her arteries clear.
Only White 2002 CF shirt in existence. Official & Genuine.
SWV, JL, unfortunately I’ve got to agree with Steamer. I would love us to appoint Ian Taylor as manager, promote the youth team and see us win the Champions League but that isn’t going to happen.
I’m a traditionalist but I’m also a realist and the reality is that the sport of football as we all remember it has gone and it won’t return in our lifetimes.
We’ve tried the young and hungry approach – which turned out to be cheap and not very cheerful. The truth is that unless you’ve got oil millions to throw at the team then you’re pissing in the wind.
Southampton go about it another way and they do it better than anyone, but ultimately where will it get them? They lose their best players every season and their manager every other season, which is fine until their academy hits a barren patch or they get a managerial appointment wrong and the slide begins. Besides which it would probably take £50 or £80 million to even get us to where Southampton are now.
We need to ask ourselves what do we want from Aston Villa. Without major investment, we’ll be bobbing along in the bottom third of the Premiership and might even manage to make up the numbers at a cup final every 10 or 15 years. I want more than that: I want an Aston Villa side that befits our great football club. I can’t stand being patronised by fans of little clubs like Chelsea and Man City who just happen to have got lucky in the lottery of foreign ownership.
Sadly, I think it’s a case of if you can’t beat them, join them. It’s sell your soul or be doomed to mediocrity at best, and I don’t think there is a third way, unless you count giving up watching professional football altogether.
SWW
had a great day mate , just the 90mins in between spoilt it . l went as did a lot of the others as we could only see this as being our last big day out as were all hitting the 60+ now , as you know its the company you keep and thats what it was mainly about saturday , bit of bad news about one of our lot , got to spend 7 weeks down Plymouth in the compression chamber they use for when you get the Bends while diving , ironic really as we both done scuba diving and kept within our limits ,but his illness has forced him to have to use this , anyone live in Plymouth and got a spare room for 7 weeks , and we chatted about the old days and who has gone , l bet Boots, Sean,Coke ect would have been turning in their graves with that non-event, didnt like reading about Jack , but as Runtins says he knows about the young kids with too much time and money on their hands , nearly got talked into getting a new ST , but Nah .lv had time to think and lm going keep my money , a lot of the lads felt shafted saturday and a lot of ill feelings towards the club ,
l will keep you posted about the meet up and hopefully it will be at Geds place in Evesham ,
Andrew P: “Sadly, I think it’s a case of if you can’t beat them, join them. It’s sell your soul or be doomed to mediocrity at best, and I don’t think there is a third way, unless you count giving up watching professional football altogether.”
Well, Andrew, I found at the age of 30 I couldn’t sell my soul anymore and for some time dropped out of so-called “progress”. That was 40 years ago and I’m thankful for the health of my soul I did that, as it opened up my mind to how things could be done differently and I modified my life as a result.
And I think that’s where everyone is trapping themselves by assuming that you can’t do things differently. We tend to just accept what we’re told these days (before Maggie I reckon people used to argue more) and that’s not going to get us anywhere.
I recognise that most think that “who are we?” to interfere and perhaps matters have inexorably moved on now to such a speed that we’ll not be able to stop the train.
But – don’t worry – I predict that other world and cosmic events will occur over the next couple of years that will cause us to have to change.
JL, I’m not after a life lesson, I’m talking specifically about selling out in the context of oil rich, Sky-age professional football.
You’ve written before that Aston Villa wouldn’t have been the force in the land and therefore wouldn’t have had the rich history they now have without being the moneybags of the 1880s or whenever.
I’m genuinely interested in how you see Villa making any kind of meaningful progress without major investment, or perhaps you are content to see us bumbling along with the clubs like Hull, QPR and Stoke?
Andy P i am in your totally on your last post
did anyone see the villan that rang tekkers agent – footage
seems tekkers is desperate to get out and whatever may be happening at villa is not in the slight bit temping him to stay
st75 i didnt go to the barbie in the end – had a bad feeling about the game and didnt want to be around the landon scouce glory hunters
Andrew P: “JL, I’m not after a life lesson”
It wasn’t … it was just offering some reasoning: reasoning which applies to everything, not just Villa and footie.
Andrew P: “You’ve written before that Aston Villa wouldn’t have been the force in the land and therefore wouldn’t have had the rich history they now have without being the moneybags of the 1880s or whenever.”
No, Villa didn’t become financially ‘big’ until the late-1890s. In 1886, in fact, they nearly went bankrupt and then McGregor pulled ’em round and they went onto win the Cup for the first time the next year.
No, if you’d followed my line of reasoning in my earlier post, it says that that kind of thinking (growth out of money) is now old thinking. It will soon disappear from our eyes I assure you.
Andy P and JL you are both right in point you have made – but ultimatly AP is bang on the money that without major cash the our club or any other will not compete for major honors — there is no getting away from that
JL, so what is the alternative? How do we do things differently at Villa without throwing serious money at the first time? How can we produce a football team that befits our great football club, a club that I can take my kids to watch and that will make them proud rather than embarrassed to support?
I don’t want us to win everything, but I would love to see us challenging for trophies. S75 and my brother both made the point that Saturday was a great day out spoiled by the match. Our support showed how big a club we were and how big we could be again, and then the game started and the reality hit that we were just cannon fodder. We were just making up the numbers. I want a bit more than that.
Saturday showed the depth of the mire we are in in terms of football. Also look at this – if the league was decided over two legs – http://www.hinckleytimes.net/sport/football/football-news/how-would-premier-league-look-9366713
We have been so bad this season and a few more now that all you can do as a fan is soak up the banter we rightly deserve and maybe save only a few select ones for responses.
I would dearly love for us to have discovered a Wenger in the 90’s to build a club up with minimal spend although i imagine if you really analyse the figures there has been some big money go in from their board along the way.
Lets hope whoever takes over does so soon and with loads of money.
S75 – saw some of Chris fighting on youtube – love it when he knocked out the scouser in the second. Some mates are opening a gym in the old institute that will have a MMA and boxing ring also loads of free weights (dumbeblls to 75kg) and benches tell Chris to look out for it take a look and if he thinks he can train there we can sort him a membership at least.
Frem,
You’ve made a friend in Trotters on page 55 of TBAR.
Saturday showed how far we are behind the elite in this league, without a takeover and significant investment we are doomed to relegation next season, as possibly only Watford look worse than us.
Andrew P: ” so what is the alternative? How do we do things differently at Villa without throwing serious money at the first time?”
I am, of course, suggesting that *all* will change … not just Villa…
The world just cannot go on as it is – in every aspect.
Bib, until the last couple of seasons I think Wenger has kept them where they are on a pretty much self financing basis which has allowed them to build their new stadium., and to think he still gets stick from some Arsenal fans.
We missed a trick in the ’90s partly because of bad management on Doug’s part and partly because of bad luck. For every Arsene Wenger there were dozens of George Grahams, Bryan Robsons, Jim Smiths and Dave Bassetts. We never stumbled across our own Arsene Wenger and the rest is history.
Bib, as I said to you earlier, because the finances of the Sky-6/Champions League elite have moved on so much in the last 20 years, I don’t think unearthing another Aresene Wenger would be enough now to allow us to bridge the gap, because there is a massive gaping chasm between clubs like us and clubs like the Arse.
JL, that’s a bit too cosmic for me. You’re turning all David Icke on me now.
Andrew P,
The race is on for world wide coverage its our only source of income we haven’t really exploited, clubs are doing end of season tours as well as pre-season. I would think our showing in the cup final lost us several million potential custom……erm I mean fans.
Perhaps we could build a fan base of people who don’t like winning, isn’t that what they teach in schools these days? for instance we could get in shooting positions but refuse to hit the target so as to be sporting, hang on we’ve already implemented that. What about adding a clown element to our defence? or a short goalie? this is tougher than I thought those lads at villa have covered every angle. One things for sure we will have to try to stop winning things its costing us revenue.
MK, thank you – it’s all a lot clearer now. I suspected it would be something like that or alternatively little green men were going to pitch up at Villa Park and declare that on their planet the words Aston Villa are sacred and they were joining us in the good fight to ensure Villa’s intergalatic domination for the next thousand millenia.
Andrew p, little green men are probably a whole lot more likely than champions league for us 🙂
Anyone else thinking foreign players are a better bet because they have less of a drinking culture mentality? going young and british could mean an upswing in the local nightclubs incomes but not much else or am I being cynical
Back home at last after my great w/e in Birmingham and trip to Wembley, where I saw a lesson in football, that I may never see again.
Arsenal took off at 150miles per hour and managed to stun Villa for the first twenty minutes, and somehow we managed to hold out, even though TS’s team selection was not the one to face Arsenal, and have a hope of winning the game.
I wont go into detail to discuss the game, as there has already been plenty said on here already, except to say that we looked more like a team when Gabby came on, and he and Sinclair should have started the second half, with Jack withdrawn, who was like a rabbit in the headlights most of the game. The game may also have been very different, had Guzan played and not Given, who was totally responsible for the second goal, which I am sure Guzan would have saved.
I wish to say that I am fully behind Jenny and all her comments on TS and the team. It was his team selection, his tactics, and the blame is as much his as the players, if not more so, and wonder how much the players felt that they had the wrong players and set up to work with, and is this why the results have started going wrong.
I also think that TS attitude towards Gil is not isolated, but he does not appear to like any of our Spanish players, otherwise why has Sendeross not featured, and Sanchez been used more, perhaps they have difficulty understanding him.
I also love this piece about the team after the game:
Despite spending 90 minutes fruitlessly chasing Arsenal players around the pitch before picking the ball out of their own net four times, the Villa players were keen to return to the pitch after everyone had gone home to ‘see what a shot on target feels like’.
ADVERTISEMENT
The groundsman and his staff were forced to wait for over an hour whilst various members of the playing squad attempted to hit the ball in the general direction of the empty net at the end where most Villa fans had been sat several hours earlier.
As one witness explained, “It was a bit sad really, they only had one ball, so when each player missed they had to go and fetch it.”
“Which took ages when Tom Cleverley had a go, as it got stuck behind a chair in row L.”
“Shot after shot missed the target, with Fabian Delph and Jack Grealish seemingly insistent on passing outside to non-existent wingers every time they got close to the 18 yard line.”
“Eventually we had to turn the floodlights off – they cost a fortune to run you know.”
“It was dark for about 30 seconds when we heard Gabby Agbonlahor cheer and claim to not only have hit the target, but to have scored in the empty net.”
“But we have goal-line technology now, it didn’t cross the line, I assure you.
I would like to thank a true Villa fan, Katie who chatted to me all the way home on the coach after the match and was still full of positives about the Villa. I also want to thank the Villa fans, Blue Noses, Stoke and PNE fans in O’neills on Saturday night, who all came and chatted with me, danced with a Wembley flag, and rounded off a great day out, in spite of us losing a match I would loved to have won. I am happy that I made it to Wembley and saw a Villa team play in the final……a better set-up, better tactics…and all may have been different…..in spite of what may have been the best Arsenal team to grace Wembley in my lifetime…….the last one was when Ted Drake was playing for them and he put seven past us..!!!
Let us hope that TS may have learned something from the day…and he might become a good manager….but it is a poor workman that blames his tools….
PP nice theory but Senderos is Swiss and speaks 6 languages, probably why he help gel the multi language defence
I personally think that the way TS set out the boys they were bound to fail at wembelee
Wenger clearly studied villa ans starved tekkers of all supply
We compleatly played into there hands with our tactics — there fullbacks could push on unchallanged until reaching our fullbacks
jack n zog were lost to this game by there starting positions
I don’t think its rocket science —- pack the midfield — doulble up to block crossses —- two men protecting the centre backs —- hit them on the break — even if we lost with this approach it would have been a sort of contest
Shame Gardner wasn’t available as he’s done ok at DM at forest, I agree with runtingz thoughts but unfortunately Sanchez and Westwood don’t play well together, maybe Gardner and Westwood could or even give Bakuna a run in a DM2
Andy P,
I know we are helpless to change it the game is what it is, a completely immovable object even the farce at FIFA will not even dent the image of the beautiful game.
We are heading into the abyss where players will earn £1m a week , we see players like Agbonlahor earning around £60k a week, we are talking £3.12m a year for a striker who has scored six goals, the world has gone mad.
The one thing this game cannot change is all the good memories I have, all the good people I have met watching AVFC.
The game of football can go to hell in a handcart for all I care, my love for the Villa will never wain but the game in general tends to leave a rancid taste in my mouth.
AVFC
ST75,
More bad news but will email for more info, I will be up to Evesham or Worcester for a meet easy to get on the train from Brizzle so let me know.
AVFC
Nice post PP.
SWV,
Friendships prosper in adversity mate. I’d made my mind up ages ago to knock AVFC on the head at the end of this season, just sticking around to see what happens with the take over, then zero interest.
Regarding the future of footy, the FA are supposed to be entrusted with its future, so that means its totally down the gurgler, a untrustworthy and incompetent organisation.
In the next few years i expect to see a European League which in fact will made up of the bigger clubs from Italy, England, Germany, Spain, France and possibly Russia unless WW3 breaks out, notice i said bigger rather than successful, If AC Milan finished bottom of Serie A and Parma won it then 100% certain AC would receive the nomination. The league would probably be made up of the wealthy supposed elite – Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal from England with Spurs and Liverpool strangely regarded as successful enough to qualify – Spain would supply Real and Barca probably Atletico Madrid and a couple of wild cards because no-one else wins trophies in Spain – Germany would supply Bayern, and Dortmund for their attendances, no-one else comes near so they’d probably include Hertha Berlin who have won bugger all for years but are a capital club – Now here’s the funny part – France, who do you regard as a big club in France ? PSG because they’re a capital city club, Marseille get big crowds, who else ?
I foresee a league with no promotion or relegation and attracts virtually all of the TV money and major sponsorships.
The domestic leagues will scrape around for morsels until eventually each of the individual clubs either die or merge into a single entity for each city, Birmingham has this already.
AVFC will never join the top echelon again, the FPP was put into place to protect the status of the so-called top clubs as was the Champions League, who could accept the European Cup without the likes of AC, Inter, Juventus who weren’t winning their domestic league as regularly as before.
Never mind Sepp Blatter, the entire football hierarchy is twisted.
Steamer,
Good post and you maybe closer to the truth than most people realise.
AVFC
Paul,
I am really surprised that you had a go at TS, following up on Jenny’s comments.
For goodness sake, he came in only a little over 3 months ago and changed around the atmosphere at VP for the better – and we’ve not been relegated.
Let’s see how he does with his own players – then have a go at him if necessary.
… or have a go at me! 🙂
Steamer,
Interesting to see your vision of the future.
Runtings: “pack the midfield — doulble up to block crossses —- two men protecting the centre backs —- hit them on the break — even if we lost with this approach it would have been a sort of contest”
OK … and we lose 0-8! 😉
We don’t have the players to compete against an Arsenal team who were in that vein in the way you suggest which is why TS chose as he did. I feel it was the only option he had given the players available.
The Arsenal’s football was great and we should just acknowledge that i.m.o. By far the best team won, and we were lucky it was kept to that level of scoring.
Blatter gone
Well I was driving home and the Heads Gone section comes on talk sport . Guess who – Benteke’s agent . Why – because a prankster rang him and he unwittingly revealed in no uncertain terms that Benteke will do “anything legally possible to get away from Aston Villa’. I don’t blame Benteke – he’s too good to Wally around in the relegation zone every season – but what a clot his agent is – he’s blown his chance of getting a great deal (now he’s revealed his hand ) and he will no doubt upset some of the villa fans .
John – my criticism of TS was confined to his part in the cup final – not generally . He us quick to claim responsibility when we win so it’s only fair he shares responsibility when we are thrashed . I also wonder why the villa PR put a gagging order on the players following the defeat . Only Vlaar was able to talk to the Dutch press .
We will just have to drown our sorrows at the Evesham meet up – got a feeling it’s going to be a summer of disappointment after our season of discontent !!
With my positive hat on – we could be sold – if we are not – no Benteke – difficulty attracting class players to a club that finished 17th – no “we are going to rebuild and invest ” reassurances – Andy Gray’s son had better be right about that sale !!
My friend had a fantastic seat at Wembley – this was his response when I texted him about Benteke
That’s all we need however it does make sense as you know I had a better seat at the side in line with the 18 yard box, I changed it from 1 behind the goal originally we were row 18 fantastic seat and view. The players were warming up in front of us and the fans were chanting Benteke’s name but he didn’t acknowledge them at all which I thought at the time was odd but didn’t think anymore about it. Seems he had already made his mind up”
The Villa PR department seem determined to cause havoc around the club, wasn’t the new bloke a mate of Paul Lambert who went up to Jockland to offer him the job and started the day Lambert left ?
Jen,
I remember him telling a little lad at BH that he wasn’t going, a few days later he was angling for a move.
I don’t believe that some multi billionaire like Arison/Ellison etc are going to come in and buy Villa saving us from another season of dross. Why would they when there are better options available and easier ways to make money. After the multiple rumours and let downs last summer, it seems the rumour mill is back in full swing, and because we are so shite on and off the pitch we are clinging to every hope/false dawn/tit bit of info and any reason going to believe this nightmare will end soon. I hope I’m wrong but I think this summer and next season will be pretty underwhelming and we will be again fighting it out to avoid the drop, but as it stands I can’t see 3 teams worse than us. Yes TS is better than PL but he is still a novice and is learning on the hoof as some of the shite results and performances recently show.
once we got walloped by Southampton at a time when we didn’t know we were safe, (so not due to complacency but tactically beaten)Timbo should of at least gone to 442 or even 3 at the back. imo it was on the cards arse would copy them and attack us with pace. Gabby or Sinclair up top with benteke for pace or grealish behind benteke in a 4411 with a midfield of Sinclair,delph, cleverly and bacuna, much more solid but with pace to spare.
Yes steamer I remember downing doing the same thing – I said at the time he scored the winning goal last day of season he’d be off inspite of his “I will stay even if they are relegated “. We will misps Teckers more that’s the problem .
I’m with you B62 – the annual close if season “billionaire to buy club” begins – just in time to attract players and get ppl to buy season tickets . Cynical yes – because we’ve been fooled before.
Not site who the PR person is steamer – remember them selecting a Scottish bloke not sure whether he is still there . Notice the OS wheeling out the players to do their “confident we are moving into big things speil – with the footer “season tickets on sale now “. Dylan Thomas they’re not
Wonder if TS regrets taking us on yet?
There can’t be a club more in a mess than our selfs
We have 6 players worth keeping. One wants to go. We have a squad full of utter shite. We have an owner who know one knows if he’s staying or going. Know one knows if he will put money in, or the new owners if they come in
To wrap it all, sounds like the shite Macron are staying as our shirt sponsor
I am disappointed Benteke is leaving/wants to leave, but can anyone honestly blame him? He is ambitious and we simply are not. What has he got to stick around for? Another relegation battle, more underwhelming lower league signings, no real shot at glory. Yes he would be paid handsomely for his services, but he isn’t a Villa fan it’s not personal for him like it is for us. It would be different if we were actually giving it a go and challenging, but we aren’t and don’t look like doing so anytime soon. The flip side of him wanting away is unless someone meets the club valuation/clause fee of 32.5m , he isn’t going anywhere, then we could have a sulky player not giving his all only looking for a way out. Let’s hope whoever coughs up does it quick and in big numbers, and that it all gets reinvested into this extremely poor squad.
Frem
Macron have another year left, TBAR were getting ahead of themselves with the kit rumours, unfortunately I have an awful feeling the same is happening re rumours of new owners and huge investment
Jenny,
My comment was really to Paul, but I frankly don’t know why TS is being got at for *anything* – yet. TS is a human being and yes I’m sure speaks from the hip according to what he feels, and in the situation of what he has inherited he’s entitled to behave in any way he likes in my view – short of losing his temper.
To be frank, I think TS thought that *any* way we were set up we were going to have a difficult job, and just put out a formation that served us well in the semis – not probably thinking that Arsenal would be as good as they were.
Thinking back over the years I don’t think I’ve ever known such a derelict state in which the club has been in, playing-wise – and akin only to the 1966-69 period i.m.o. He must have been mortified and very glad the season is over.
He now starts from a clean slate.
On Benteke
If he wants out then good luck to him. Let’s just open the door for him and say “thanks for the memory”. And then get on with the task of re-building.
Oh … if signs for a Prem club then we need to get Laursen back to tackle him!
JL
I t may appear that I am just having a go at TS, but I do feel that since his team selection at Soton and the dropping of Guzan from the team completely, there has been a different atmosphere among the players, and perhaps the changes and tactics have not been favourable.
I do feel that the rants that TS has had towards the players is also uncalled for, and if he has something to say it should be one to one in private. There is still no real explanation fot his attitude towards some of the players, i.e. Gill and also he has never given Sendeross a chance to show his earlier season form.
Paul,
Perhaps the team and the *real* ability of a number of the players is really the issue, not TS?
I’m on TS’s side and I’m unashamed about it. When he has built his own team then he will have to deal with them differently, I agree.
John , I’m sorry I thought you mentioned my criticism of TS . I’m not “getting ” at him personally but his management skills on Saturday were lacking IMO. I have been quick to applaud him when he does well , but as it’s a discussion , will give an honest appraisal when he coukd do better . His comments after the game, his keeping Zog and JG on , and reluctance to change things contributed to the loss . He is an inexperience manager so is learning on the job .
JL I do think TS has had to do a lot of bulling things up to keep some of the players on side. The comments like we would be fine and not in this position even with the same squad next season for instance is clearly him trying to build up their confidence to get us over the line. Its now obvious that its not his view at all and he seems to hold them privately in more than a little disdain. Maybe that has leaked into the collective physke considering how delicate they have been. Doesn’t mean he shouldn’t of reacted to the hammering we were getting though as they were only one up by half time, he didn’t and that surprises me and is a little worrying.
He does do some strange things though, a 16yr old novice,who showed it, instead of Gil, unfit players and a left winger instead of a fully fit French international at LB, Senderos ignored for an unfit Okore and Vlaar, Sinclair ignored while Gabby plays, strange.
The CF has completely knocked the stuffing out of the fans, unless there are some big moves in the transfer market then gates will fall even lower, it’ll take more than promising lower division players to keep this club in the PL, however, i’m confident that the takeover will happen, interest in football is at an all time high in the USA and billionaires tend to have massive ego’s, when you have $56b a few hundred million isn’t going to make much of a difference.
Just to deflect from more -ve things, in compiling up-to-date Villa stats the other day, I see that Gabby – 72 goals in 307 league games (including sub appearances) – is just behind Yorkie – 73 goals in 231 league matches.
Yes, there’s a significant difference, but then I looked at another stat re: Dickie York, and attacking winger of the 1920s and about the same number of England caps as Gabby. He also played a striker on a few occasions. Dickie York scored 80 goals in 356 league games. Now there is an intriguing comparison, as Gabby has spent a good amount of time playing left-side these past few years.
Dickie York (an old Aston KE schoolboy who only just survived an aircrash as a pilot in WW1) was well thought of, but being mainly a fast winger he didn’t have the expectation of having to score on his shoulders. On the contrary, Gabby started as a striker, but since MON went he has been played in various roles, so I’m not sure any longer what he really is.
Under the circumstances, I’m inclined to say that in view of York’s stats and the role that Gabby very often plays these days, Gabby’s scoring rate ain’t so bad.
But Jenny, this is an inherited side he’s had with very limited ability and character.
Let’s please give him chance to build his own team. 😉
Plus Olbyon are in DD, the dummies taking them over must have looked at AVFC first and been rebuffed, probably because a better deal had been agreed already, they certainly wouldn’t choose those mugs over us.
PS I don’t think mutton and all the mid-fielders getting booked unnecessarily helped his mood much either
Steamer: “The CF has completely knocked the stuffing out of the fans, unless there are some big moves in the transfer market then gates will fall even lower,”
If Lambert were still there I’d agree. But TS has infused a different type of footie that has raised the fans interest. He’ll keep ’em coming through the gates I’ve no doubt, unless he proves to be a chimera.
Mark,
You’re a bit worried about TS’s reaction at the Final, but my feeling is that he must have felt like “thank God this season is over and now I can do things with the players I can get.”
For me, TS’s work started *after* the Cup Final (and Villa having stayed up, of course). Now those events are over he feels happy to put the season behind him, I’m sure.
Steamer
Across the blogs quite a few have mentioned the baggies are at the due diligence stage, with new buyers that have also looked at the villa.
Everyone is of the same opinion that we must have rebuffed them, however perhaps they see WBA as a better investment, cheaper, stable and they still get the big TV cash, with a fan base who don’t have lofty ambitions, so less pressure to spend.
B62 be funny if it turned out to be Tesco’s or even better Aldi
Nöt read all the comments yet but Some Good ones.
JL i also tove that ts has kept us up – he has swag and after Lambert it is a relief to have ts at thé club
I do believe tactics play a huge part in the game Sunderland showed how to frustate arsenal
I do like ts but i also think tactics is the weak point for him thus far
Saying that i still hope he can,become a top manager
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/transfers/christian-benteke-future-agent-duped-into-revealing-liverpool-and-tottenham-target-will-not-sign-new-contract-10291740.html
B62 – there is a big part of me that believes you’re right. A lot of similarities about the stories of take over and the timing.
Steamer – you’re right about the future of football.
JL lets hope he doesn’t get his hands tied too much, it will be interesting to see his ideas express through his signings, also I am dying to know what involvement the youth side will have along with the likes of gardener, Bennett, Robinson etc.
it will also be interesting to see if Lamberts buys are as hard to shift as the previous managers were, somehow I think they will all go
Loads of interesting comments…
When it comes to managers and players and tactics and who’s in and who’s out…It’s really difficult to gauge.
Sendeross, for example. Yeah, we played well enough with him in the middle at the beginning. But he’s been out all season. No match fitness, no integration with the rest of the team. Should he have played? Dunno, but I can understand why he wasn’t picked.
CNZ? I seem to remember our finest, most fluid football had him and Bacuna linking up well. Did he play well in the Final? Nope. But I can understand going with the set-up that seemed to show the most promise.
Ah, but Bacuna…Seems as if Hutton was in for the defensive aspect. Experience, nasty edge. Didn’t work so well, but I can understand. Mistake? May well have been. But he’s more the safety-first choice.
Use the same tactics as other sides? Good idea. If you’ve got the right people to do the same jobs and execute the same game plan.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that TS tried to play to our strengths, rather than set up around Arsenal’s. One says “let’s have a go.” The other says, “let’s try and survive and steal it.”
Now, “Let’s have a go” may have been naive…But we’ve complained enough about negative tactics, parking the bus, and hoping for a smash-and-grab on the counter.
In other words, yes, McLeish would’ve set us up differently. I think TS tried to set the players up with, “Here, you’ve done well this way, so get out there and do it again.” Continuity, known quantities, etc.
As folks are saying, let’s hope TS learns. But I can’t imagine that having played so relatively recently, and as a captain, that TS is missing things we’re seeing. He doesn’t seem stupid. I guess when you say, “Let’s go and attack and be positive, it’s better than being negative…” Well, what happened in the final is what can happen when you have a go.
I know if I had been out there, I’d have rather taken a rollicking for dropping back, defending, and trying to turn the tide than staying up and not pressing and dying for cause. Likewise, pressing only works if everyone’s doing it.
There were some overawed players out there, cowed by the occasion, I think, and feeling like imposters.
JC: “There were some overawed players out there, cowed by the occasion, I think, and feeling like imposters.”
Yes, allied to the fact that the Gunners played exactly the right tactics to ensure the Villa players didn’t start to gain any confidence. I was intrigued by how the Gunners were so tight in defence and midfield, yet the rumour was they’re susceptible.
I reckon that Wenger finally found his best team over the last few matches of the season and Villa just happened to get on the end of it. I feel sure no matter what format TS were to try, Villa would still have had a licking.
If Arsenal can keep on with that form I reckon they could be next season’s champions.
JC I’d agree if we hadn’t lost the last two with Nzogbia looking bereft of ideas. I was moaning about Bakuna being our only source of crosses bar the odd one from delph, turned out he’s our only source of attack. the slick one twos that made us look decent disappeared around the wet spam game and turned into hopeful balls into Benteke. He in turn stopped the movement and chances he provided before and became easy to mark. The writing was on the wall. Not easy to remedy but mutton to nullify arsenal threat on his own was not it.
JL apart from the 4-1 hammering of west brom arsenal were not scoring many until Walcott came back in that game. they beat liverpoo by a similar score but otherwise they lost to swansea at home, should of lost to manure, held 0-0 by chelsea at home with one shot on goal to chelseas 3, held at home 0-0 by sunderland. they are a decent side I’ll give you that but champions? maybe Wenger will go out and buy to make that happen but he needs at least 3 top players imo
http://7500toholte.sbnation.com/2015/6/2/8715345/aston-villa-premier-league-winnings-money-transfer-television
Disturbing things about TS –
Usually too late changing things, ie Saturday.
Rates English players.
Rates London players.
To judgmental in his early assessment of players ie Gil, wtf is that all about ? criminal waste of an asset when the team is full of crepe, NO-ONE will ever convince me that he shouldn’t have been in that team.
and most disturbingly of all – rates Bennett.
A gooner at work today reckons there FA cup performance reanks up there with when they beat barca 3 – 1 — he reckon they would have beat almost anyone on the day
JC excellent comment and i think you have the balance right in the dilema TS faced in what to do in the final
Comment on TBAR –
My only disappointment is nobody will pay money for Gabby…so we’ll be saddled with him. whoever gave him that 4 year deal wants hanging!!
Personally I’d stick him in the clubshop full time….not to speak to anybody or try to serve…just stand there with a kit on all day looking useless….bit like he does on the pitch!!!
Runtingz,
So he’s putting Villa on the same level as Barca ? Anybody would have smashed Villa on Saturday, anybody.
steamer 🙂 fair point – we are a p poor side
its all gone quite at villa – isnt TS having meetings with players this friday ?
maybe after that we may get an idea of who is taking over or not
Tekkers – top talent — kept us up twice — wants to go now and even though i am gutted now we know his thinking i just want him gone leaving is at least 30mil better off
Yes Tings – if Tekkers is going can he go quickly and not to self pity FC, christ on a bike how annoying would it be to see Milner and Tekkers playing for them.
JC – good thoughts, but cant for the life of me see how playing Hutton is leaning towards a “go for it” mentality, more a “mental”ity. Your post got me thinking that where Wurzel went wrong was that he sent his troops out neither on foot nor horseback. They didn’t know what they were doing, add in that once in a season performance from Arse plus a soft ref and we get the result we all dreaded.
The only team who look willing to cough up the £32.5m are Liverpool, now this pisses me right off as we all know, that the gypsies love to throw unwanted players into the mix. I can see them trying to make up half the fee with players they want to offload like Ricky Lambert, Enrique etc etc. Chelsea and co are sniffing but only the Scouse scum seem genuinely interested at this stage. I agree this sale seems inevitable and we need it to go through as early as possible in order to get a replacement
Bibulus exactly we looked like 3 different teams, and the midfield looked like 3 different players from three different teams.
tekkers insisting he wants to be first choice says the poo are the team to give it to him. He won’t get that at the top 4
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/03/aston-villa-linked-alexandru-chipciu-comments-on-his-future-amid/?
I’m not pinning my hopes on any takeover, I can’t see it happening and haven’t seen any evidence there are any interested parties that can make a difference. Randy has come out spouting bollox of a new chairmen etc but it’s irrelevant because there still wont be the required investment to move us forward. I expect a fair few changes to the squad, but I’m worried we will be swapping like for like in the terms of quality, and we will again be struggling to stay in the top flight next season. I hate what this club has become, we take one step forward and two back, it’s pretty depressing being a Villa fan as we know we can’t challenge even mid table, and need a miracle to win a trophy .
when you look at the difference in prize money from 1st to 17th its about £32 mil. How will we ever get anywhere if there is this much discrepancy?
for us that’s more than our last 2 years budget unless we sell tekkers.
Maybe TS had an idea tekkers wants out which is why he revealed the release clause — thought it was strange to do that at the time when knowone seemed to be aware of it but it makes sense if he wants the cash in asap to do his business
Tekkers can go too pool – he doesnt suit the way they play so unless they change style (brends rodgers rocket science formations and tactics) teks may struggle to make an impact there
the pool fans are slating teks bigtime and reckon they could do much better with 30mil plus
he may end up coming back too pre season with his tail between his legs
grass isnt always greener teks
could be either TS being smart believing we’d get a hammering and tekkers made to look poor on the day putting off clubs because of the perceived value, or he expected a big performance form tekkers to start a bidding war? all in all it was strange timing
http://www.sportspromedia.com/news/aston_villa_announce_signing_from_liverpool?utm_source=feedburner&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+SportsProDailyDeal+%2528SportsPro+Media+-+Latest+News%2529&utm_medium=feed
the above link doesn’t scream sold to me
Mark: “apart from the 4-1 hammering of west brom arsenal were not scoring many until Walcott came back in that game.”
Yes, Mark, I am aware of that … but the fact remains that at the end of the season they found form – whatever happened against Sunderland is something else i.m.o.
B62: “I’m not pinning my hopes on any takeover, I can’t see it happening and haven’t seen any evidence there are any interested parties that can make a difference. ”
Well, something seems to be happening I would say … On that link that Mark quotes above it talks about “huge commercial ambitions” as a quote from Villa’s new digital partners.
It’s still early days … we may not know much more for *at least* another couple of weeks.
Steamer,
I’m not at all sure why Gil is rated so highly. He scored one goal against lower tier opposition and looked a lively player – but whether he was really a significant improvement I’d say is a moot point.
And if he doesn’t fit in with the way TS wants the team to play, then that’s it. Why are we so worried? I suspect some on this blog are trying to knock TS off his perch before he’s even really started! 🙁
John i don’t believe or a any vibe that any regular AVL crew are against TS
i think people are just calling it as they see it in there own view
my view of TS is i like him but i am not going to kid myself into thinking he is a top manager especially as he has less than a years experience
he has kept us up but i think any half decent manager would have done that — its easy to get excited about what TS has done so far due to lambert , McLeish and Hollier being so bad at the club
i would have prefered Pardew myself as he gets his teams to play well but also has a lot more tactical know how — of course experence could take TS beyond that level but imo he is not there yet
He needs a long holiday after around 12 games which show how hard it is to be villa manager
while i hope he takes us to europe – i think unless he learns about tactics or gets some assistance in that area he will struggle for consistancy in this lge
TS may well have started the “we can’t keep him if he wants to go…” exactly to tease out early interest and get the whole business over with. £32m is a cagey figure. Just enough to make him pricey enough to think twice about yet give the club a more than 4x return.
With Pool fans wondering whether he’s worth it, that’s exactly the point. Just enough money to occupy a lot of thinking about where their transfer budget is going.
At the same time, even though he’s kept us up, one wonders whether TS likes having all his eggs in one basket. The two 10s seems to be all about finding a way to free CB up and create threats from other areas. TS talking about needing to play a certain way…ie, ways to get Benteke involved, but also others around him.
Took a lot of players flooding forward to make up for Benteke’s lack of movement and, dare I say it, quality on the ball. He’s a great scorer, absolutely. But he only rarely makes things happen on his own out of nothing. Doesn’t track back much, doesn’t press. Doesn’t dribble well beyond controlling and holding.
The goals came, and others got involved, but it took a commitment from a lot of players.
I don’t think Liverpool will have fixed the loss of Suarez by signing Benteke.
Bottom line, I’m not sure that TS wouldn’t rather have the £32m than try to hold onto CB. I think he’d like him to stay, but don’t know that he’d be a TS signing….Charlie Austin does a lot more around the pitch and was every bit as lethal.
Back after a few days off work and to get the final out of the system, I didn’t think TS would allow a one off game to be played out with so little effort, it was embarrasing. Murrays pub was jammers and everyone in fine voice before/during and after so we did Villa proud in the support stakes.
Time to move on from the final as to dwell on this would only frustrate me more. I wish Benteke would go now, I’d rather TS has the time to buy replacements as opposed to letting this drag on. Given speculation is all we have in terms of incoming players, it does sound like nothing can be sanctioned without new owners in place. I live in hope that this is the reason why the crap players are still with us and nothing concrete is being done to rebuild this club and avoid another nightmare season of relegation fighting. It may be just two/three weeks in Dubai time for players/managers but TS needs to build his team sooner rather than later and give us fans an idea of what to expect, it will help with season ticket sales.
UTV
Bibulus-
I think Hutton was a cautionary selection that perhaps undermined the go-for-it approach. We had to sacrifice that link-up with Bacuna, which didn’t help the interplay on that side or the balls into the box.
Likewise, Richardson over Cissoko. I think that was as much about understandings and continuity. He’d been hurt, but also featured in the good run. Not saying I want him as our LB, but if you’ve been getting performances after abject misery, it’s hard to start tinkering much.
My only real beef was dropping Guzan. Whether his form has really dropped, I can’t say. There’s been a lot of comedy defending in front of him for years. But I think he’s a better all-round choice than Given. He doesn’t seem like the type to coast…he’s fiery, emotional, gets into it with defenders, is very vocal.
Jl All those teams managed a result against Arsenal with a different approach to TS’s maybe Sunderland got lucky but it Illustrates that they are not unbeatable with the right tactics, that’s why I mentioned them as we were equally poor as they were great.
JC – Agree bacuna offers more when on song and seems to have better understandings with team mates going forwards. Certainly not a natural at right or left back plus believe Richardson is OK, like cissoko defensively, just wish he could cross as well as he defends then would be down with 10 assists each season.
For once it may have been the case where Guzans hoof ball could have helped the team bipass the midfield. Still will never rate a player that lets not forget was let go by the Villa to not be signed on a free by any one else.
JC- I thought that maybe Given was an emotional choice as he’d played throughout the cup and he’d already said he’d play. That said why did he play Steer against Burnley?
As he went for solidity at the back I’m surprised he didn’t drop Nzogbia for Bakuna who gives a little of both, could of pulled Delph in with Westwood, Grealish out left cleverly central in a 4231. at least we would of had numbers in midfield.
Runtings: “my view of TS is i like him but i am not going to kid myself into thinking he is a top manager especially as he has less than a years experience ”
Yep, exactly. But we’ll only really learn about him once:
1. We see who he’s signed (depending on money available)
2. We see team selections based on his own players
3. We see results based on his own players
Mark,
My point was that Arsenal came to form at the end of the season – i.e. the very last matches.
There was some interesting comment in the press that Wlishere’s absence made Wenger re-think his midfield – and it has appeared to work.
JC: “[CB] Doesn’t dribble well beyond controlling and holding.”
And he often doesn’t do that well very well!
CB is far from the finished article (as I think we all know really) and my general feel is that he’s a lazy player who happens to be able to score, and score well. Put him under a SAF-type manager and he’d soon be showing a lot more sweat – do you remember how hard Yorkie had to work under SAF?
JL
” There was some interesting comment in the press that Wlishere’s absence made Wenger re-think his midfield – and it has appeared to work.”
As we had clearly gone off the boil or been sussed out I wish TS had done the same. He had 180 minutes worth of previous game time against them to see how they exploit our weaknesses, I just found it odd that we would set up the way we did, C’est La Vie
JL I think CB’s lack of movement started in the wet spam game and stayed, whether it was under TS’s instruction we can’t know. the ball in from Bakuna became the norm and the slick interplay between grealish ,Delph,zoggy,cleverly and Benteke came to a Halt. when he’s mobile we play better that’s for sure .
Afternoon all.
Bibulus’s comment sums it up for me
“Your post got me thinking that where Wurzel went wrong was that he sent his troops out neither on foot nor horseback. They didn’t know what they were doing” Excellently put BIb – as this is what was confusing me when people were talking about our folly in “going for it” when all I saw was us retreating in shock – hence the embarrassing no shots on target.
Maybe the FC thrashing has hit us so hard because we were not expecting such a dismal display because Tim SHerwood has improved morale, confidence and creativity so much. In that way he was a victim of his own former success (save for the Saints and Burnley games. ) This is what we came to expect under Lambert but not TS.
I want TS to succeed and I witnessed my best game for years at VP when we beat Everton. This was down to TS injecting energy and confidence into the team. The beating by Saints could have happened to any of the lower league teams – so was not overly concerned – but the Burnley game and then CF showed that this new fond confidence was fragile and is a work in progress.
Now for Benteke. He has to go – as Mark Bosnich said on Talk Sport this morning. Whoever buys him have a potentially world class 25 goal a season striker – lucky them as I am a big fan. No he may not suit Liverpool’s style of play or be an answer to Suarez (but then again few would) but with better players around him I can see him as a cross between Bergkampf and Drogba . As Peter WIthe and a few other old pros have said on the Benteke situation – when you get no service from the rest of the team, eventually you stop making the runs – anyone would. I hope that he plays for Arsenal or Chelsea so that he can fulfil his potential – he is far too good for Liverpool and their fans are clearly as deluded as ever.
On a positive note, no one thought Benteke would prove to be such a good player when he was photographed shyly entering BMH for the first time . Who is to say we can’t find another gem?
11 goals in 10 games – 20 plus for his first season – that isn’t a bad return in a team who have been playing like AV has done.
we had misery ,lies ,more misery more lies
now we truth we need to know if we are going to be sold ,and it needs to be done quick
on sherwood ,the last 3 matches have shown how poor of squad lambert built over 3 years, players of champion ship level fills our squad lowton bennet senderous westwood gabby ,zog has finished bottom 5 for around 6/7 years on spin,
our clubs need football men in charge ,needs to get scouting system right it should not be hard to get decent keeper 2 full backs remember guzan was let go by villa and nobody signed him up
everton have signed baines jakelka and kept them why can t we hold onto stars
James: “everton have signed baines jakelka and kept them why can t we hold onto stars”
*That* is a very good question and a *very* good point! 🙂
In fact, I recall that Villa were interested in Jagielka when he was at the Blades, but didn’t fight for him. Perhaps it’s because we had Laursen at the time…?
Jenny: “… this new fond confidence was fragile and is a work in progress. ”
Absolutely, Jen. And it comes back to waiting to see what happens between now and August, the apparent clear-out and new signings of the type TS wants … and the result of all that.
Well if TS signs the amount we are talking about we could be back to square one. His eye for a player is unknown and could be worse/better than Lamberts of course.
Then theres the standard we are going for, Unless we buy quality its a lottery and even then a risk, and as yet we haven’t heard how much he’ll have to work with. Then its down to whether TS and Villa and the wages they pay are a big enough pull.
If TS has to replace those that have been mentioned already, plus fill other positions we know we will need on top, its going to be a hell of a pre-season trying to gel 10 + players together into a mid table team. If he does it then he’s got something about him if not we have another huge mess. But hey we are used to that
Mark,
Yes – precisely … lots of ‘ifs’. But we just will wait and see to find out whether TS is a Ron Saunders or a Billy McNeill!! 🙂
If there’s no take over then TS might be gone, he doesn’t seem the type to hang around a no-win situation and destroy his career, we know from experience what bs merchants run AVFC.
Regarding CB, unless we get top dollar it may be worth hanging on to him for the final two years of his contract, a good season in 2015/16 and we may get the 32m, whatever, i can’t see us scoring many goals without him whoever we sign. Then again he might sulk his way through his contract and do nothing.
I really can’t believe that some folk are defending Lerner, the man is a disaster zone, the damage he’s done to our club will take years to repair and how he had the nerve to turn up at Wemberlee staggers me.
I’d keep Weimann too, 2m isn’t enough, he should be played CF, not wide and not MF, he showed promise when he played up front.
I think your enjoying the chaos a bit to much John 😉
Its definitely a strange one steamer but he seems to make his mind up pretty quick about players. Weird one with Weimann as he’s made the bench countless times and yeh 2mil is nothing for a forward with prem experience, I feel the same as he’ll probably be on fire for Derby next season.
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/03/aston-villa-star-jores-okore-pulls-out-of-under-21-european-cham/?
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/03/everton-linked-tom-cleverley-hints-why-he-could-return-to-aston/?
Mark: “I think your enjoying the chaos a bit to much John”
🙂 W-e-l-l the *real* chaos was 4 months ago when it all looked bleak and ‘orrible.
I think right now is just a waiting time to see what happens. Can’t do much until the dust settles.
TS seemed to do a fantastic job on his arrival at VP and really managed to rally the troops and get some decent results to help us over the line, but I have very strong feelings that after the semi-final against Liverpool there have been changes in mood, and the players have not been happy which culminated in the disaster at Soton, and may have connections to the dropping of Guzan, the reintroduction of Hutton, and a number of other matters. The demeanour of the team and TS has changed and it was somewhat obvious after the Burnley game and there where many moments during the final, which leads me to believe that Sherwood has come up against player opposition already.
I really would like Tim to succeed, but it may be a very rocky road to ride. It is just not worth commenting further on the very poor tactics employed in the cup final. Villa are now in a very strange place with no apparent top players, or leaders, or any real joy to look forward to at the moment.
There should have been a joint statement from Tim and his players apologising for the under performance, and a promise that they were all pulling together in readiness for a new season in the Premier league and a determination to build a side worthy of Aston Villa…..but there has been absolutely nothing……apart from everyone will be on their bike and leaving….not a good omen…
I wait now with baited breath for the new positives to come from B6..!!
Cleverley to Everton done 5 year deal, Weimann to Derby, Lowton to Boro
Benteke looking to leave ASAP, add these to the likes of Kosak, Cisshoko, Senderos, Helenius, Bent etc etc and we are going to see a massive change around in the squad. Yes most our squad are poor or average, but how much will TS get to spend?? We are looking like we will need to bring in 8-10 players, so far we have only looked in the cheap section!!
b62- that’s my fear, cleverly could well have been our marquee signing on a free what will we get know? That said its not done yet.
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-boss-hurting—9385866#rlabs=3
We have enquires about a loan for yohan cabaye, unfortunately palace have bid £10m if the rumours are true, no brainier he will go to palace, there in London, a mid table team looking to kick on, will pay more wages and he gets a signing on fee whilst pig get some cash.
I know it’s early but this is shaping up to be a depressing summer.
B62- first impressions are if cleverly goes to Everton we are not going to have a lot to spend and the takeover is a pipe dream. This is assuming the players know anything about a takover and if I was TS I’d be telling Cleverly hold fire we are about to spend big, unfortunately in this case the silence is not Golden
Another example of the lying bastards employed by Villa ‘ Oh Tom’s enjoying his football’ Tom’s really happy’ well Toms just buggered of at the first opportunity like virtually anyone else who can kick a ball will do. We’re just going to be left with the crepe only its going to be worse crepe than last season. How he hell did Villa get into this mess ? ask Doug “Mr Aston Villa” Ellis.
All the goodwill built up since Lamebert was booted has evaporated, the energetic, vibrant young manager we appointed has had to take a holiday after 12 games, fair do’s, he’s earned one, but it shows the state the club is in. Please God, let their be a takeover because 1m% certain we’re doomed next season if this shower stay.
Apperently Cabaye has no interest in joining villa and see Palace as a far better option
are club really is a joke at the minute and if there isnt major investment , which signs are there isnt any we are surley going to fall out of the prem next season
Cleaverly isnt exactly Prillo but we cant even sign him — so signs are its normal service at villa next season
when your best players want out it sets a trend and looks poor from the outside. the FA cup may have done us a lot of damage in the way we are perceived by potential signings
The chances of anyone worth a mint buying this shower of shit of a football club are slim to none. All evidence points to another year under Lerner and feeding off scraps from the bottom table, hoping there are three worse teams again.
its getting more and more painful
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/04/report-aston-villa-wanted-new-leicester-city-signing-christian-f/?
I do think that we won’t be doing any business until new owners are in place and that includes the sanctioning of the sale of Benteke, so a lot of rumours will drag on for the next few weeks.
I don’t see Benteke going anywhere in England, he doesn’t suit the bindippers grandiose impression of brilliant at football they are, in their fans opinion he’s Balotelli mk2, I’d rather see 30m in the kitty and 3 10m players instead because we need numbers and higher quality than we have in so many positions.
In my opinion we need
keeper to replace Given and challenge Guzan
two full backs
cover for Vlaar
Midfield enforcer
Two strikers
What we have two young CBs Clark/Okore who will do very well for us, Guzan and a good attacking midfield in Grealish/Delph/Sinclair and thats it
potential with Kinsella/Gardner/Robinson
And rejects in Weimann/Gabby/Zog/Cissokho/Hutton/Cole/Luna/Bennett/Westwood
Unsure about Sanchez/Baker
UTV
Mark,
I think you will see AVFC linked to more players than you can shake a stick at, once agents realise we are in the market for new recruits they will use us to hike the price of their clients, you just wait and see as soon as Benteke hops aboard the gravy train we will be linked with every striker known to man.
Were we really in the market for Fuchs who knows but we have experienced enough transfer windows to ignore all the speculation and rumours and stick with our only true source, Steamers dog walkers.
AVFC
Two hanged themselves Saturday night and the others in a coma after an overdose.
Some things change, some things stay the same. Take Spurs for example. Here’s a statement from the club about its status and prospects:
“Historically, Tottenham Hotspur have been one of the country’s ‘big’ clubs with cup success and a strong supporter base.
Delusional as ever.
two who steamer
Runtingz,
The dog walkers that SWV referredto.
Steamer,
You got mail, if that’s the case I apologise for my flippant comment I know life can be shit but there must be a better answer.
AVFC
Swv i know mate but this could be our most important transfer window ever if we are sold why not say? Seems logical to me
🙂 🙂 nice one steamer i should know better than too take things to seriously
DOR yours is the first post in a few days that gives some postivity again — we have been let down by our club so much its hard to believe we will be taken over and the nightmare is put behind us — villa feels like a dead club walking at the minite
Runtingz,
More positivity, i’m running out of it, but at this very moment apparently some highly rated idi… sorry player is at VP for talks, not been linked before but he’s here.
Runtingz,
Its surprising how the club drains your energy at times like this mate
turnover 20114-15
http://www.astonvilla.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7518957
predicted by time machine 😉
anyone want to buy a home shirt with cleverly on the back?
cant just leave it like that steamer – who ?
its not this bloke then?
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/04/charlie-austin-non-committal-over-future-amid-recent-aston-villa/?
not him either
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015/06/04/do-aston-villa-already-have-tom-cleverleys-replacement-in-gary-g/?
Interesting points in the accounts that the only time the wage bill went down was under McNob, and went up under Lambert…..
and now the latest news is we are about to sign Seamus Coleman on a three year deal from Everton…..having a medical today….
PP decent signing if true.
I imagine the wages went up as he couldn’t lose the bomb squad and had bought new players in on low wages which he also didn’t play. They then had to cancel players contracts to boot, a total feck up and if it wasn’t for the tv money rising he’d probably been binned earlier, shame it went up
Let us hope it is the start of the new beginnings MK.
New post of desperation by GOG….