I was going to belatedly opine about the Walsall match—in brief, why would anyone expect anything but a bore draw when playing 4-5-1 with Gabby as your 1—but events, as they often do, supersede the best-laid plans.
Of more immediate interest: two long-rumored signings coming to fruition. And I can’t say I’m terribly enthused.
Don’t get me wrong…These two could be exactly what Villa need. I’ll have no idea until I see them playing for us, and Steve Bruce, instead of someone else. But it does induce a bit of head scratching. (Funny aside: Since Dr. Tony has been in charge, most of the persistent rumors regarding Villa’s transfer activity do come to pass.)
In both cases, you understand the idea. Glenn Whelan: industrious, combative, does the dirty work (though his tackle rate isn’t all that). Ahmed Elmohamady: suited for a 3-5-2, played for Bruce, can put a cross in.
Obviously with Elmohamady, I’m wondering how, if we’re up against FFP, we can afford the luxury of four right backs. Who makes way? Is Hutton going? De Laet? I’m okay with the idea of Bree backing up Elmo and learning the trade, and I’ve no belief in Hutton as an answer going forward, but it leaves one wondering at the parade of players drafted into both fullback spots, with none of them sticking. Last time I looked, Luke Young and Kyle Walker were the last decent right backs we had. Maybe you throw Cuellar in there, too.
Maybe Elmo is deployed as a winger. I don’t know. And I have no idea whether De Laet was ever any good in the first place, never mind having lost a season to serious injury. But obviously, we’re now a bit overweight there, and one assumes Elmo will be the starter.
Whelan? Well, he is what he is. I think the signing, on a two-year deal, is perhaps rather uninspired. Surely there were potential candidates younger than 33. I’m sure the fee and experience had something to do with it. But maybe it will be effective. We can only hope.
The big issue with these signings for me is that Villa are now getting a bit aged. We’re in danger of becoming an Over The Hill Gang.
Take a look (all ages figured from 2017 minus year of birth…So I might be cheating some of these players a few months, but close enough):
Neil Taylor: 28
John Terry: 36
James Chester: 28
Ahmed Elmohamady: 29
Back line = 30.3
Henri Lansbury: 27
Conor Hourihane: 26
Mile Jedinak: 33
Glenn Whelan: 33
Birkir Bjarnason: 29
Albert Adomah: 30
Midfield = 29.7
Scott Hogan: 25
Jonathan Kodjia: 28
Ross McCormack: 31
Gabriel Agbonlahor: 31
Forwards = 28.8
All told = 29.6
So basically, 14 players vying for a starting outfield spot add up to an average age of 29-and-a-half years. I can’t be bothered to figure out every other teams’ average ages, but…a 30-year-old starting squad? Seems a bit long in the tooth to me.
Now, we can lower that average by including:
Leandro Bacuna: 26
Aaron Tshibola: 22
Jack Grealish: 22
Gary Gardner: 25
Andre Green: 19
Sam Johnstone: 24
Of the younger outfield players, only Grealish and Green, and maybe Bacuna, figure to play a part, week-in week-out.
So. Perhaps it’s no wonder we lay off opponents. And Grealish doesn’t run around like a 22-year-old anyway.
In other news, we might be getting more than £4.5m for Veretout, seeing as £7m seems to be on the table. That can’t hurt. As long as it’s spent on someone younger than 30.
Over to you.
The Author
John Clark
John is co-owner of AVL, and has followed the Villa since the '70s. A journalist by trade, he is, by most accounts, a very nice person. You can follow me on Twitter @JClarkKohoutek. It's an astonishing experience. Or a complete waste of time.Comments 248
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Hi JC, I can only think the management have hit rock bottom moneywise with FFP and rather than steer Bruce toward the brees of this world they have let him have his Head in the hope he can get that fifth promotion? having no money to spread around (we have the 12th biggest wage bill in the UK 20th in the world) binning the manager is out, they have stuck by him maybe because of rep and maybe because they cannot afford to do otherwise.
If we go up it is going to cost the earth to stay up and the good young crop we could of blooded for two years in the Villa way will be ill prepared for the prem and so the buy sell merry go round continues at Villa.
Oh could of had ledley of crystal palace for free at 29 instead of Wheelan, I suspect its because wheelan has a good accurate long pass, cue bombs
Again, watching Whelan for Ireland he does play the Jedi role of protecting the back four and distributing short passes to more attacking midfielders but is very uninspiring.
Our squad is too bloated, lets hope that along with Bruce having an epiphany on how football should be played that he doesn’t succumb to continuous rotation to massage the egos of the footballers or worse still tinker with the a first 11 and formation (if he knows it) when things go wrong as we seen last season.
We have 4 players who can play right back, overkill but it could suggest that Elmohamady will play further forward in a 442 but a 442 doesn’t accommodate our over abundance of midfielders. If he’s a wingback in a 352 then you’ve got three players who either won’t get a game or maybe natural fullbacks who we then have to allow develop as wingbacks in this promotion year. Time being of the essence we don’t have the luxury of developing players when results are the only thing that matters.
352 allows us to accommodate more of our excessive amount of midfielders and given Bruce’s penchant for not taking risk then you can absolutely see Whelan and/or Jedinak in the holding role and Hourihane/Lansbury/Bjarneson fighting for 2 spots with Taylor on the other side as despite wanting the more attack minded and fearless Green on the wing, he’s no wing back.
Upfront Kodija with a partner, he doesn’t really matter who partners him as he’s too selfish to even check and we don’t play to Hogan or McCormack’s strengths so we’ve a passenger going thru the motions.
Johnstone will play every single game in goal as we have only got supporters backing him as opposed to any real challenge for the position.
Hi MK
Hope you are wrong on us bombing our opposition, it will be meat and drink to defences and we don’t exactly have a Heskey, Gestede type player, there’s an idea imagine having Gestede still where we could flip around throughout the game how we attack as opposed to what will be a very congested attempt to continuously play thru the middle via Hourihane. I can’t see Elmohamady having much joy with any crosses with our short-arses.
John,
You said: “why would anyone expect anything but a bore draw when playing 4-5-1 with Gabby as your 1”
In fact Villa looked quite lively in the first half and should have scored a couple i.m.o. Gabby did fairly well, causing their cb a few headaches. As a lone striker he does it better than the other two currently available.
The real bore was the second half. I expected the game to really go into overdrive, but did it heck.
I like your ageing analysis! Imagine the average if I were to be signed up! 😀
Playing with the idea of 4-2-4…
Bree, Chester, Terry, Taylor;
Lansbury, Whelan;
Elmo, Codger, Gabby, Green.
Not worried about the age, its not that bad.
More worried about shifting the dead wood. Proving difficult. Was thinking of giving vertout a chance but sod him want him gone. Part of the worst villa team i have seen. Trouble is no one wants to buy amavi, vertout, gill only gone on loan. Vertout was meant to have a medical with someone yesterday and never turned up! Hutton and richards will be hard to shift too.
Dr tweeted a few weeks back his frustration at contracts given.
Hopefully now with whelean it will mean lansbury not playing quarter back role!
John
We will be 352
Would like to see bree as the 3rd cb over baker.
Andrew,
Yes, I’m aware that the formation is more likely to be 3-5-2, but I was just playing around and thought that a 4-2-4 looked better.
But I don’t for a moment think that Bruce will follow my advice. 😉
Or 4-4-2…
Bree, Chester, Terry, Taylor;
Elmo, Lansbury, Whelan, Green;
Codger, Gabby.
fully expect crouch to sign now the papers have had all our signings down to a tee
why sign elmo unless bruce needs someone in dressing room 2promotions 2 relegations does exactly write a great cv
whelan is sooooooo boring to watch like a hypnotist watch over and back over and back MARK KING your stats are not on same player must be mistaken identity
as for doc this transfer window is as bad as lambert signing cole sendross richardson and we had to pay them all to go
Whelan’s signing confirmed.
Mark,
“the good young crop we could of blooded for two years in the Villa way”
Indeed. Given how long it’s taking this team to come together, we might well be no worse off had we played more of the youth.
DOR,
“Our squad is too bloated, lets hope that along with Bruce having an epiphany on how football should be played that he doesn’t succumb to continuous rotation to massage the egos of the footballers or worse still tinker with the a first 11 and formation”
Maybe the idea is that if we just have too many players, the ones we want to move on will seem more like victims of a numbers game than being of questionable value.
Agree with you on Gesteded. I’m still puzzled we moved him on so quickly when he was the only hold-up man we had and we keep lumping it up to Kodjia, who is anything but. Gestede was also more likely to get onto crosses than the far shorter front line we’ve got now.
Not a perfect player, but was unlike any of the other attackers and offered a change-up.
JL,
I’d drive the average up a bit, too!
Gabby? He does try. He just doesn’t score unless we’re playing blues.
Andrew,
I’m hoping the age isn’t too much of a factor…but as Mark is saying, if we get up, we’re going to have more work to do on the squad if we want to stay up, and we’ll have a number of older players that will again be difficult to move on. Two defensive mids at 34? Not thinking that’s a recipe for keeping up with the PL.
Maybe Green, RHM, Davis, Lyden & Co will be brought along (Bree, too) with an eye on the future, but they won’t all end up getting that much time this year, except maybe Green.
Gabby over Gestede for me any day though neither score too many!
Gabby’s still the only striker to score in the pre-season games, too! 😉
The Squad
I don’t see anything about age to worry about here.
Bruce is clearly after know-how and commitment to get us promoted. No frills.
Assuming we do get promoted this season then several of those players will be ready to be farmed out to the lower leagues anyway, and that’s when we’ll see the younger players making a lot more impact.
It can seriously be argued (and with validity) that the younger players need bleeding now, before we hit the PL, but I suspect we’ll see several continue to make a serious impact as subs.
And – back in the PL – I imagine we’d buy a couple of high quality and experienced players (already playing at the top) to help the youngsters through.
DOR- JG- I cant recall seeing wheelan play but in his stats is the oddly named Long accurate passes? is 952 in his career, Jedinaks is 250 is that vs long inaccurate ones? he also doesn’t give the ball away a lot apparently? playing at stoke I am not surprised he launched it a bit. Against Walsall they were all having a go at smashing the ball in behind the full backs, Jt and Samba had a couple of goes Samba’s being a particularly good one.
JL- Gabby vs Gestede? second joint top scorer last year until Grealish got his goal against Brighton
4 in 8 for rudy so we sold him? mind you we sold Sinclair as well who scored 9. I in 2 years for Gabby, Ruddy 30+ goals in 50 games for Blackburn ruddy second joint top scorer again in the prem for us with 5 , I guess it must be us that are crap not him 😉
JL “Bruce is clearly after know-how and commitment to get us promoted. No frills.”
should that have been “no football” ? 🙂
Worryingly that statement is very true and might just show how fragile position we are actually in for the Management to condone it.
Also age is not a problem if we get promoted and then build a whole new team to compete, Might be bit more of a problem if we don’t and have an even older squad to get us up next season with even less funds and nobody but the crown jewels to sell, I give you QPR under Rednapp.
mk
is stokes pitch narrowest in premier league that aided the long throw, that teams would rather give away a corner than a throw,
Mark: “4 in 8 for rudy so we sold him”
4 in 8 *and* 10 apps as a sub! 😉
No, I thought he was all over the shop. Yes he scored a lot for Blackburn – but like Hogan and Mac his team must have played to his peculiar strength.
JL- weirdly they probably did what a strange bunch, he also had Rhodes beside him
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0T7Sdb3MFp8
JL- try 1 in 13 for gabby
Villa fans crack me up.
All last season…we rely on jedi too much, cant win without him.
Villa…sign a player who prob does jedi role better, played over 30 games last season in a mid table prem side.
Villa fans…. Moan.
James
Used to crack me up that watching teams at stoke undr pulis when that chap had long throw. Players used to panic not knowing to let ball go for corner or throw!
Dr tweeted. Something like no more ins until at least 5 out. Poss 8 out.
Kodjer back at bh.
Andrew- we now have an older cast than dads army , moan I should cocoa 😉
I think the fitness staff have added a defibrillator and some Zimmers
andrew
its not whelan that is problem ,bruce had signed 3 midfielders last january all on big money along with him giving gardner big pay rise, we have bloated squad full of older players that nobody wants,take lansby if we go up he will have 3years of 40 thousand a week contract left now what will we be ablle to do with him thats just one example ,remember we still have gabby hutton and richards we cant shift
jg- spot on
Mark: “try 1 in 13 for gabby”
Yes, but in only 4 of those did he start!
We know he’s short on the goals side, but he has a broader all-round game than Gestede.
Mark/James,
It all depends on who plays and whether they do the job required – not how many players we’ve got to get rid of. That’s the Doc’s problem – not ours. I wouldn’t want to take responsibility for all that!
john l
we have about 35 players in which bruce has signed 10 [johnson twice] gave new contracts to [hutton bunn gardner] so we can assume they are going nowhere fast
22 players and we would need to sell at least 10
then the bigger picture how many of our players would you think can step up and play in premier league
john l
now no need for you to take piss out gabby saying he was broader than rudi, even stevie wonder could see that
andrew
would expect them to struggle this season, hughes making pitch bigger[it was smallest in pl]changing style of play as well,hard to do
Avrerage age of squad is 26. good blend and mix for me. Remember again, we are rebuilding the worst villa squad in my memory…going to take a while! Good solid pros like terry, jedi, whelen, elmo, lans, hourihan and yes we currntly need to sell a few which we are in the midst of doing. Patience, 42 days left till window shuts. Dr has said 5 will go soon. Should be 8. And yes its tough clearing up randys mess…will take a year or two more i reckon to completly do it.
James,
“we have about 35 players” – yes, but I still say that’s purely a management problem that is not our concern, surely? If Bruce puts out a team from that lot that can’t play then *that* would be our concern i.m.o.
On Gabby – very droll! 🙂
bruce has been told to build a team to get out the champ. Be happy with have a plan.
Once up we build another team to try and stay up. Not sure why worried about. Lansbury, conor thor aint on big money. Not sure why stressing about it.
lansby 40 thou
houriane 35thoou
birr 25 thou
big money when trying to shift them to championship sides
john l
just couldnt resist that one
We only need to shift, hutton, micah, amavi, vertout. Gg or bacuna. Sounds like we will.
I like the fact we now have great competion for places for once. No excuses for bruce, dr again done well to get bruces targets.
Johnson and whelen could easily of gone to prem teams.
A squad should always have 2 players for every position. 22 very good players. Rest of squad id have youth.
JL- but he’s the lone striker? who else plays a non scoring lone striker? and what are we doing? crossing the ball to Thor lol 🙂 I get why you like Gabby but he will not get goals and we need them simply as, but a better option than Gestede if you play to his strengths definitely not, we did it with Benteke who then looked lost at Liverpool.
James
They are not on that. Guaranteed.
Yeah stoke struggled a bit last season. Linke to delph for 13 mill which would be a bargain.
Player Nationality Position Weekly Wage
James Bree English Defender £1,200
Rushian Hepburn-Murphy English Forward £3,000
Andre Green English Midfielder £5,000
Sam Johnstone English Goalkeeper £12,000
Jed Steer English Goalkeeper £13,000
Mark Bunn English Goalkeeper £17,500
Gary Gardner English Midfielder £20,000
Tommy Elphick English Defender £25,000
Libor Kozack Czech Republic Forward £25,000
Birkir Bjarnason Iceland Midfielder £25,000
Ritchie De Laet Belgium Defender £25,000
Nathan Baker English Defender £25,000
Jack Grealish English Midfielder £25,000
Albert Adomah Ghana Midfielder £25,000
Leandro Bacuna Curaçao Midfielder £25,000
Jordan Amavi French Defender £30,000
Alan Hutton Scottish Defender £30,000
Conor Hourihane Ireland Midfielder £30,000
Jonathan Kodjia Ivory Coast Forward £30,000
Neil Taylor Wales Defender £30,000
Scott Hogan English Forward £35,000
James Chester English Defender £40,000
Henri Lansbury English Midfielder £40,000
Mile Jedinak Australian Midfielder £45,000
Micah Richards English Defender £50,000
Gabby Agbonlahor English Striker £55,000
As you can see, there is a large range of wages as Aston Villa FC. The young players are earning very little compared to the big stars. You can tell that this club have been recently relegated, as they still have wages on their books that you could associate with a Premier League club. Stars like Gabby Agbonlahor and Micah Richards are on sky-high wages that not even some Premier League clubs like Bournemouth could afford to pay.
Andrew we had the 7th highest wage bill when we dropped I think we are now 12th in the country
Thats bs list.
For a start gabby is on 25k
I know for a fact lans is not on 40k
Jedi 45k!! Never.
Cissokho and vertout pretty much gone
Andrew- you know best mate I am sure our wage bill of nearly 90 % turnover is just lies to the tax man
The Premier League have now released figures for last season’s parachute payments, and Aston Villa, Newcastle United and Norwich City banked just under £41million following relegation.
Having made only £6.9million in prize money from the Championship campaign, with the EFL splitting money evenly between all 24 second tier sides – we received a basic award of £2.084million added to a solidarity payment of £4.3million, along with 16 live matches giving us £520,000 – Financial Fair Play concerns from fans will be eased with the £40,915,922 parachute fund.
Having spent almost £80million on new signings in Dr Tony Xia’s first season under charge – split between Roberto Di Matteo and Steve Bruce – Villa unsurprisingly have one of the largest wage bills in the division and shedding numbers remains a priority this summer.
The parachute payment for the second season with us finishing in 13th place and not getting promotion back to the Premier League at the first time of asking, should see us pocket around the £25million mark next summer.
MK – I’d be interested to know the source of that table of wages at the Villa. Bree on £1,200?!! Never surely …….
oldvilla
OV- I just had a look around on Google even Arsenal have a lad on £2000 a week although I agree it looks low GG was on about £5k until he got his deal and he’s 22 Bree is 19
http://sillyseason.com/salary/aston-villa-players-salaries-99599/
A typical championship wage is £10k week, we must be like a honey pot 🙂
heres an interesting blog the swissRamble he’s an English accountant living in switzerland and dissects the football teams accounts. Hers Hull’s and it shows old brucy likes to spend the wedge 🙂
Also Bruces quote
“Manager Steve Bruce pointed to the lack of goals: “Nearly 50% of the games we’ve played, we’ve not managed to score. That’s given us too much to do. It’s a pretty damning statistic.” 😉
http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Hull%20City
oldvilla
think that was bree wage at barnsley went to 20 thou at villa
andrew
why would the wages be wrong, lansby was out of contract at end of season and we just gave forest a fee because of panic, gabby is on 55thou
Trusted source who knows these things! Gabby since relegation on 25k.
But anyhows its no bother…we said after last window we need to be more clever cause of ffp.
Sold sanchez for 2.5 mill.
Got johnson, terry, elmo, samba, whelen for….2.5 mill.
The guys know what they are doing. Sell vertout and amavi for about 12 mill and we are well in profit. Pray we can shift richards, hutton!
Samba in for free. Elphick gone for money. Again, being run properly. Some good business being done. Refreshing after randy, and the idiots fox etc.
andrew that still £24k too much 🙂 I think if they had halved his wage he would of buggered off not refuse to go out on loan
you do know we will get £0 for them don’t you when we come to sell, which we probably won’t as they are on 2-3 year deals on a nice wedge 😉
Glad Samba signed though and I hope Wheelan can sort the midfield someone needs to
mk
we have went from del boy in boardroom to rodney and grandad in boardroom making decisions
Vertout sounds like a right idiot…saint etuione not happy with him. Wonder how we got relegated with these wonderfull players, gill, vertout, ayew, amavi, guzan, lescot.
They make me sick…memorys of how much i hated them those last few years in the prem.
Makes me appreciate whelen… He will actually run, put a shift in and play like he cares.
God the times sat at vp watching villa team not even bother jumping for a header or running!
steve bruce looking for 2 more signings dos autobas and olaf stenmur
JG- I really am crossing everything that we go up because the fallout from this will be big, All Villa’s eggs are going into the basket with the help of a lump hammer. Every time we get players in I think just maybe this time but no they still can’t play, here’s hoping mate.
Andrew I suspect they won’t match his wages
James
What makes you say that about keith and the dr?
Gabby, hutton, richards are parasites. Gabby may, just may get back in his box now terry and co there. Not left to think he is the man. Stupid idiot.
Well theres a thiught now we have defence and cdms sorted it will allow are attackers to concentrate on there job more….hmmm
Samba, terry. Hourihan and lansbury can cross a ball. Maybe we will be a threat at set pieces now!
hutton is perfect example, bruce spent 4m on bree yet carried on playing huuton to enable new contract at cost 1.5/2m ,even tho delaet would be fit for start new season
handing out contracts like confetti, to players approaching 30 orover with no sell on value
Andrew if we had kept Rudy we could of sold all the other strikers and gone for corners, who the hell would you mark with JT Samba Rudy baker Jedinak and chester in the box? we could of had a back five of CB’s Bruce would of been in his element 😉
Possible January newspaper story – Dr. T has told Bruce his experiment with signing older players has not worked and we’ll now sign younger players with potential sell on value. When questioned, Dr.T said in no way is this Moneyball, we’re trying to find the right blend of youth and experience to hopefully push on from 9th spot and claim a play-off spot. We’re still on course for Champions League in 5 years (adding – maybe 10).
Chants of ‘We want one nil to the Villa’ and ‘You’re too old to wear the shirt’, have not gone down well with the board. Having drawn the last 6 games against teams below them, Villa fans would take a one nil win at this stage. Questions are also being asked why Bruce persists with playing Whelan and Jedinak in holding roles.
Our football correspondent Mark King told us ‘Bruce is trying to park two buses in front of goal to stop the rot. Kodija is looking isolated upfront and it can’t continue.’ Some of your tweets show a split Villa fanbase.
@JGILL I give up, 240 characters is not enough to say how shite the Villa are under Bruce. Bruce Out!!!
@JLERWILL Give Gabby a chance, he got us one goal in a one nil win last season.
@Andrew1 Give it time, we can all see Dr.T is changing the club for the better.
@OldVilla I wish Villa fans would stop being so negative, that’s 6 games unbeaten.
@DOR Told you Bruce hadn’t a clue.
Darren
Love it 🙂
Just reading how sambas worked his nuts off to earn a deal with us in the last 6 months.
Fair play, chatacters who want to play for us. Makes a change
Darren,
Ha! 🙂 At least a sense of humour still exists … there’s life yet in being a Villa Supporter!
And here’s another tit-bit … the chance of the average crowd at VP this season exceeding 35K. The Villa team will be carried to promotion by wave after wave of love, and roars from the lions’ enclosure.
And Jack will be King! 🙂
James
Yeah hutton getting new deal done my head in too.
Still very much a chance he will go, wed def want him.
We want 1 mill they dont want to give money!!!
DOR- top draw lol
dor
first class,and definetly a lot more than you can say about bruce
Hopefully it will remain fiction and we blast thru the season on the crest of an old wave but an experienced one.
Thanks for the responses, have a great weekend my fellow Lifers.
Why is it that I can be optimistic about the club & the players, but when I think about Bruce I turn into Marvin the depressed robot?
IanG,
Clearly you knew Bruce in a previous life! 😉
Ha ha!
Afternoon JL
IanG- because the team should be pretty decent, made up of players that before they came here were pretty decent. I don’t mind the pragmatic dull Football is it was effective but when you can see so much talent trying to be dull it just pisses me off, I don’t even mind the old Players, Although we had a plethora of older players anyway 26+ how do they need to be? Samba reminds me a bit of McGrath, Clearly has more nous in his little finger than last years back four put together. I can even see his logic I just think he likes to drive a sports car with the hand brake on.
Really warming to Samba love his attitude
“I never believe someone is better than me or that they can beat me.
“They have two arms, two legs and they are going to have to come through us to win. That’s simple. If they can do that, fair enough. But it will be tough.”
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/chris-samba-signs-aston-villa-12820614
I’d take dull pragmatic football if it wins the league. I think we have enough to win thirty games next season, which will be enough.
I listened to an interesting comment by Mark Hately recently regarding his playing days at Rangers under Graham Souness.
Souness told the team in his pre match briefings that that had the talent and were better than the opposition but will not win unless they impose themselves and fight harder than the opposition who will raise their game against the Rangers.
I do see a similar situation with our lot, we have to be up for it because all the others will. I thought that was evident last season, our inability to impose ourselves on our opponents.
Totally Archie, the players were used to being underdogs that we bought bar Jedinak and Kodjia and maybe Chester. When every team see’s you as a cup final you have to believe you are better and play like you are better. Its one of the reasons why I don’t agree with the way Bruce sets teams up, its a small team mentality, not the way Chelsea for instance do it.
JL- if we haven’t got Gestede we can certainly use Samba to good effect
https://youtu.be/OcFp0lVaNSs
Mark, are you telling me he’s really our new number 9?!! 😀
He certainly likes goalkeepers….
We should be a lot more dangerous at corners & set pieces.
I also like Samba, & I think he’s a good signing.
It’s just a bit foggy due to not knowing who’s going, & who’s going to be left, to make up the squad, to make up the team.
You couldn’t invent this, only Bruce in whodunnit mode.
Archie
If we win 30 games at 1-0, who’s going to complain, except the usual suspects.
IanG- yeah them old usual suspects the buggers who needs excitement eh 🙂
Could it be Bruce is assembling his player-coaching staff? lets face it he doesn’t appear to have coached them into a fat lot maybe the old boys will do his job for him and get us up the pitch, can’t see the older heads sucking it up if we are sitting deep each week afraid to come out of the half. Maybe Bruces master plan is to prevent himself from coaching?
I do feel that the squad could pretty much pick itself and win we have so much quality in comparison to others in this league
JL- he has at times played at 9 and done ok 🙂
Boooom best news for me. Exactly what i said yesterday.
Dr just tweeted……one thing he and bruce agreed on is to get squad down to 19 or 20 and introduce 6 young players into first team.
Beyond happy if we can do this.
And crazy that i posted same yesterday!!! I should work for the dr.
Gardner not travelled to germany with several champ clubs after him. Cissoko gone, vertout apologese, dr tweeter saint et tried to get him on cheap and just annoyed another team met our value.
The cull begins….
Something different…
I’ve just posted this as something I am conCERNed about…
https://john-lerwill-diary.blogspot.co.uk/
It will be nothing short of a miracle if they shift that lot Andrew and fair play if they manage it ,it will be a first. Can’t see the kids getting a look though even though they are going to be in the squad, a fair few were in it last season and we used green, still its a start or a gesture.
JL- Two earthquakes with tsunami warnings in Russia and the Greek Islands this week. the problem may be science is yet to take on board that you cannot do anything without it effecting the field That connects us all to pretty much everything to varying degrees, what you fear could well be true, if so whats its true intentions I wonder?
JL- I listened to a podcast which mentioned that civilisations tend to last about 2000 years and the reason why is Farming and the damage it does to soil. Even the Bible has loads of references how to treat the land/soil and why we should leave it Fallow and rotate crops. If we change the soil Biome then that changes our gut biome which then changes us, a host of mental problems and the likes of Autism etc are heavily linked to this.
Mark,
All true. But I see a short-term (15 years of some chaos followed by relative quiet) before we enter a different time…
I’ll not say any more except that these times are different to previous cycles except that which finally occurred some 12,000 years ago.
Cissoko, gill, kozak gone allready.
Vertout and amavi prob def going.
That leaves, gg, hutton, elphick, richards and bacuna….maybe ross but think he will stay. Might keep bacuna too, versatile.
Villa have ditched avtv and all content being shown on youtube.
Twitter world liking this and villa fans saying being sorted off the pitch at last.
Dont really understand why tbh.
Andrew- ever used the Villa site? its poo
used the website. Not the tv channell
Sites ok?!
Gardner could be off to forest
JL- 12,000 years ago a comet/meteor hit north America ending the ice age and a lot of life
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/did-a-comet-hit-earth-12900-years-ago/
Good clips of new boys singing… Lots of comments on good bond developing and good team spirit.
….thought there was a bad split!
Villa linked to irvine….burtons attacking mid. Link to lawrence too. Sounds like we def want a more dynamic midfilder.
Andrew- trust me there is/was what do you think they are going to say they hate each other? and there’s a small matter that half of them are leaving
We are also 15 years of a 30 of going through the asteroid region spoken of below
“The discovery also supports the theory that Earth experiences times when comet strikes are more likely, due to the planet’s orbit intersecting with rings of cometary fragments.”
https://www.newscientist.com/article/2128512-ancient-carvings-show-comet-hit-earth-and-triggered-mini-ice-age/
Andrew- I was watching Hogans video on youtube and one thing he said was the long distance running was a good place to bond and help pull each other through, now why would he say that? wasn’t half a season any good for that? or had he been told to say it? I think a few words have been said if you ask me, from what I was told it needed it and I have seen a picture of the source with JT on the AVFC site so I do not doubt it one bit.
Mark
Well mate hopefully its getting better. Will show on he pitch
Oh asteroid regions & death of all civilisation, thank goodness, I was starting to ‘Marvin’.
IanG- anything to help
If I was cynical I might think that Tony Xias plan to trim the squad down to 19-20 and pick 5-6 youngsters to train with the squad is because we are skint, and desperate to lower the wage bill?
only if I was cynical mind.
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/tony-xias-sensible-plan-should-13368419
https://7500toholte.sbnation.com/2017/7/21/16012442/the-7500toholte-season-preview-part-one-welcome-back-to-the-championship
Mark
If it’s cynical mind, that’s only the beginning.
Maybe we’re going back to buying youngsters.
One extreme to the other, when’s the next preseason?
The views of this site seem to be universal:
http://soccersouls.com/2017/07/22/having-completed-another-signing-do-aston-villa-stand-a-chance-of-making-the-top-6/
Mark: “12,000 years ago a comet/meteor hit north America ending the ice age and a lot of life”
True again. And the final end of Atlantis.
IanG,
Well, I don’t think the view is “universal” – me and Andrew don’t fit in there! 🙂
And reading it I find it just another article making news by concentrating on the negativity of anything rather than the positive. Good news never really gets much publicity! 🙂
And by that I mean that it’s not just experience that’s been signed but 4 new (old!) players who show commitment and can show the others what commitment is about. That element worried Bruce last season and hence these signings I’m sure.
Sorry – my reply was to Iana, not IanG…
IanG/Iana bloody confusing times at Villa but I fear our DrXia has been smooth talked by the silver tongued Geordie into this path. As that article suggests its a one shot option, no building for next season/ future. I always thought the promotion pedigree of Bruce was a bit of a false positive in that
Twice he had been at the clubs for years got relegated and was still buying plenty of players every season and never really developing anything lasting. So two of his promotions were kind of expected. And as it said there is a trend in recent years that his two promotions have been surrounded by promotions won by progressive young managers and football, that option is far more prevalent in going up than Bruces style. Granted we don’t know if he could of done it time and time again? if he’d got a club up then moved to another and got them up? that would suggest he knows something other than a bit of luck. He has been at plenty of other clubs though and not gone up or just left for greener pastures.
All irrelevant because we are on the roller-coaster and about to head down the track
JL- Are you saying that if we all see it as being a positive we will win? what if other teams see their progressive manager and young fast squad as a positive? does that make there way better/same?
Is it a battle for who has the most positive fans and Outlook? I look around our team I see very little pace that doesn’t give me much positivity, We are gathering not a couple but 5-6 old players in the same team where as before they were surrounded by better, younger and quicker players in their former clubs.
Surely you must of noticed in several friendly games when the youngsters came on the pace went up and the football became more dynamic? Time will tell but a mixture of attributes are required in a team and the art of buying players ready made for your needs is a special one not many managers master ,hence why I prize those that can see something in a player and coach it out of them.
interesting exercise in squad cutting
https://7500toholte.sbnation.com/2017/7/22/16013752/aston-villa-efl-championship-squad-size-tony-xia
Mark: “Are you saying that if we all see it as being a positive we will win? what if other teams see their progressive manager and young fast squad as a positive? does that make there way better/same?”
I’m simply saying that when people post something (speaking generally, not AVL) there tends to be a negative emphasis when a positive slant will produce just that – positivity. And positivity in all aspects of life tends to win in the end.
JL- but what if its not entirely representative of the facts? it did have a point deemed negative or not
Here’s an article about average age of teams in the champs, it does beg the question why “we” need to have so many experienced players? I would take a guess at the coaching of players is below par and has been for years, hence not getting the best out of the youth we do produce. Does make you wonder why when we buy top performers they rarely perform though? The players that have gone on from Villa or have done well here before moving is few but the likes of Barry were stand outs that would of made it regardless others move and find better Guidance and blossom, it cannot all be down to poor players surely?
In short why do other teams deem age and experience as less important?
http://www.examiner.co.uk/sport/football/news/revealed-how-huddersfield-towns-201617-13143485
If I were the opposition I’d try to run Villa off their feet and mark Kodjia out of the game.
lana
Shhh someone may hear you
Where I come from gallows humour is positive
Iang where I come from I like to face things positively whilst having as broad a picture of the situation I’m facing which has both negative and positive aspects. The universe is built on that I thought.
Mark: “but what if its not entirely representative of the facts? it did have a point deemed negative or not”
Probably – but there are times when the ranting gets to be a habit, I feel. Time to think with the heart instead of the head, I also feel.
It’s a lot to do with the level of mental activity that’s got the world into the state it’s in…
Jl- Mmmm whilst I am in agreement in one way I do not see what he is saying as negative just a view point. And ranting is not the sole property of the negative ask Andrew he likes a positive rant 🙂
Mark,
It’s that the article omitted to point out that “it’s not just experience that’s been signed but 4 new (old!) players who show commitment and can show the others what commitment is about”. It’s a rather obvious benefit of the signings that wasn’t mentioned and would have balanced up the article.
BTW, a “viewpoint” can itself be negative in nature, of course.
The Birmingham Mail says that “Ross McCormack, Gary Gardner, Aaron Tshibola and Tommy Elphick have all stayed at home as Aston Villa prepare for their final pre-season fixtures on the road this summer.” Plus Veretout, of course.
JL- You hope they show commitment isn’t it? they have not played yet 😉
Now you have to ask why Bruce did not target these uber committed types in January because if they are the answer to our woes and not the way we approach matches then he has made a boo boo no? Or Steve Bruce is making it up as he goes along with no real plan? also they looked very committed until they arrived here? Why do the rest of the league appear to have committed players without them being 30+ and we can’t buy one for love nor money up until now? does that not seem to be just a little strange to you? commitment seems an obvious answer to our woes if all the players we have bought show no commitment but they had to to get noticed didn’t they to arrive here? which requires committed play I would assume or someone’s not doing their job..
Last season we brought in experienced players with leadership qualities and prem and promotion
on their CV’s and…….? there has to be another factor here IMO but I guess we will find out.
positive or negative? you can lead a horse to water and all that but nagging it to death won’t make it see the light, it will or it won’t see it in its own good time.
JL- I hope we can get rid easily as the article I posted earlier said it may not be that easy and we may end up with Bomb squad MK3 that we may have to call upon yet again.
Mark: “You hope they show commitment isn’t it? they have not played yet”
Pardon? we’ve seen Terry and Samba … they fit the tag of ‘commitment’ I think.
If the other two are of the same character – and since Stoke fans are upset Whelan’s left them – then there’s another one. And Elmo should be of help.
And Gabby. 😉
What happened in last January’s signings is a funny one. I think we signed one too many mids, but they’re not players that won’t fit – though I am concerned about Hourihane. I can see him being on the bench instead of starting.
But what happened last January isn’t much to do with what’s happened this summer. We now have a much more balanced team in which the experience signed will be of great value i.m.o. Apart from other things they will give a lift to the younger players.
Now there’s commitment…!
Fans are buying John Terry shirts by the droves! 69% of kit sales have the Terry name.
So the fans that bought these will be buying new kit next season as well?
JL- Terry has made a statement by coming to Villa I will say that and Samba looks good but as you have been fond of telling me these are only friendlies in which we were rather average. Of the two only Samba has a win under his belt pre-season. We will see whether experience can keep up with the pace soon enough, until then I’m keeping my powder Dry and going on your enthusiasm hoping to be pleasantly surprised 😉
Mark
You have to see the positive with black humour or it isn’t humour, neither then is it positive.
So if you can see the negative in the positive, & the positive in the negative, then you can find humour anywhere & in almost anything.
If one is just projecting from pain then none of the aforementioned applies.
I’m also waiting to see what happens & hoping I’m pleasantly surprised, but I don’t see a lot of signs of progress yet.
Currently it looks like being hard to beat is the main game, with everything else potentially moving from not very good to the unknown.
The defence definitely looks like progress, & Samba looks like a good move, with 2 good players in both central defender positions.
Just need to get rid of Hutton, & the viking can double up as left wing back, & Borg looks like a good back up for Taylor if Amavi goes.
Looks like Gardner’s going, & we need shot of Bacuna, then there’s a bit more balance.
The forwards? Well haven’t got a clue what Bruce thinks he’s doing.
It looks like he’s keeping Gabby for the Blues games
IanG- nope no pain here, just a healthy scepticism when things don’t quite weigh up, Or if JL prefers feels right, I do draw the line at being depicted as rocking in the corner because I am not jumping for joy yet 🙂
Mark,
Yes, they are friendlies – but we also know from their previous records how they’ve shown up – Terry, Elmo and Whelan in the top class for goodness sake.
I don’t think we can expect anything but what we’ve known of them before. No surprises, then! 😉
IanG- Yes making a defensively strong team defensively stronger who’d of thought it? we may never concede again
JL- Elmo and Wheelan? top class? Elmo twice relegated with Hull? Stoke? top class? for goodness sake? stop me?
JL- I could reel out a long list of players names brought in that “didn’t do what they did before” I’ll stick to Lansbury, Hogan, Thor, Hourihane…………zzzzzzzzz 😉
Anyway folks off to the gym to get rid of some of this latent negative aggression and to look at some unsuspecting ladies bottoms. Later I will be drinking Lager which will definitely have a positive then negative effect later whilst I watch Limehouse Lizzy rock out the devils music, I will say sorry later, maybe.
Mark,
By “top class” I’m referring to where they come from: the Premiership! 😀
Mark,
‘I could reel out a long list of players names brought in that ” I’ll stick to Lansbury, Hogan, Thor, Hourihane”‘
They were not from the “top class”, were they Mark?! 😉
Mark,
Matt Kendrick in the Mail has something to say that both of us probably agree with…
He’s got a basket of ingredients, some of which he likes, some of which he doesn’t, and he’s still not sure of the best recipe for rustling up something substantial.
He has too many flavours to throw into the mix, and in his eagerness to get it right, he has tried to combine different recipes rather than making something basic that hits the spot.
Today’s confirmation that six senior players have been left out of the squad for the trip to Germany is a start – at least half a dozen are for the chop.
Bruce has had too many players to pick from and as a result it’s hardly surprising that a desire to accommodate them has led to muddled thinking.
jl
on above it doesnt help when you add 12 players to bloated squad
bruce has no excuse come first 10 matches if we dont have 22/3/4 points ,35 match trial run ,preseaon ,terry whelan samba have more experience than all other 23 clubs in championship, elmo has played for bruce now at 3 rd club for 4th time and ill will take 1 o nil wins to start with if we show some resemblance of a team
Mark
Its not being cynical to say we are skint as you say.
Dr has tweeted severl times what we have to do! emoji of scales used lots with the money one! Balance of squad needed and wage bill needs to come down.
For once perfect footballing and business sense from the top! Embrace it!
Just have to hope we can actually get rid of the ones we want.
The plan is great though.
Also wondered what you say about last season unrest. Maybe thats why bruce has gone for these solid pro types. Say what you want about whelen, elmo, terry, but they are hard working, pro types. Strong in the dressing room.
James,
We may have a better idea vs Watford next week as to how it’s working out, but of course we won’t really know until after the season starts.
James
Agree, bruce has no excuse, get it right or gone.
Andrew
Thats positive mate
JL- Kendrick is right but thats where a manager has to have single mindedness and vision of what he wants not act like a kid in a candy shop trying to use every player in the vain hope something will work. Identify what you have in training and change your tactics to suit them if you must but if you only know one way of playing you get what we have seen, some improvement, lots of confusion and some down right disasters. What it comes down to is he doesn’t have the coaching ability imo to explain what the players role is and the players next to him and keep it simple.
Watford will be a benchmark, exactly the type of up and at them team we will face. Remember last season when we played Middlesbrough of the park for one half and second they did the same to us? lets hope for better, it will be very telling of whats to come I think.
Andrew- no problem with what they are doing but making out its about development for the kids when its basic cost cutting? thats how it comes across to me (having abandoned the early idea of using the youngsters before last season) give it to me straight.
Mark
Yeah dr said in his tweets need to cost cut and balance books.
Iang
Haha yes I guess so…where would we go after Bruce I wonder?!
One of my tips to go up boro. Losing another friendly though today. Won 1 in 4! Wonder what there fans are like!!!
andrew
terry and samba caused as much bother in dressing rooms as any other pair of players going
it was the inference he told Bruce to lower squad members to accommodate the kids bit I was on about, “you can have your old player Mr Bruce but you have to have these boys in the squad so get rid of all these pesky expensive ones your not using” lol 🙂
andrew- “Haha yes I guess so…where would we go after Bruce I wonder?!”
To heaven
night folks
Mark: “What it comes down to is he doesn’t have the coaching ability imo to explain what the players role is and the players next to him and keep it simple.”
I don’t know that is it at all, to be honest. There are a lot of factors involved in trying to turn Villa around and if the club had already been turned around before Bruce arrived I might have readily agreed with you.
However, Bruce has had the pressures of a mandate from his boss to get promotion PDQ and(presumably) he felt pressure to obtain what players he could to get a basis for this season having been left a legacy that has been a huge challenge to him. With those pressures on him I am not surprised that it looks the way that Kendrick described.
I honestly think that to look at the Villa Project properly we have to first think in terms of the huge upheaval that this club has gone through and is still going through. It is like a re-birth in many ways without the relaxed situation of starting out as the Villa did, as a church side of ordinary guys just trying out their luck in the sport. Now the re-birth has to be conducted with the complete glare of full media attention and equally full expectancy from the Villa supporters and the chairman as well.
Bruce has taken on a huge challenge and even though I would see and admit some of the weaknesses that are being highlighted every day on AVL and elsewhere, I really think that Bruce should be given more support in this huge endeavour.
Mark
Damned if we do & damned if we don’t today eh?
JL
I don’t know what bruce does or doesn’t do, but we would all rather he temporarily won promotion before the order of the boot.
I can’t see him being given the time to get the midfield & the forwards sorted out & get get promotion, which is why I see a defensive game being played with the odd exception depending on the opposition, & if we’re lucky it gels enough to get promotion.
I would be very happy to be wrong, but practically it has to start with winning or we’re sunk IMO, as that would indicate that Bruce was behind the pace.
As I said I hope I’m proved wrong, as like everyone I would like to see at least an attempt to play football, & unlike Mark, I think the kids are ready to contribute & to confound, with the new signings possibly keeping it together.
But as many have said, that hasn’t been Bruce’s MO so far at any club.
Oh well tomorrow at midday on utube
Iang- unlike Mark ? I am with you, I want them in now, as I said to jl when they come on the dynamics change. Without them it’s like watching robots.
Mark
I with you there
Mark,
Yes, I’d like to see kids more involved too.
The problem is that with kids it’s a hit and miss affair and when things go wrong they can deflate easily. Jack hasn’t stood up too well to scrutiny has he? So Bruce prefers to rely on experienced players for the task at hand. And not only experienced players but the likes of Terry who has seen it all.
We’ll see the younger players involved, I don’t feel any doubt there, but as subs probably, until the target has been achieved.
IanG,
Yes, I agree that Bruce has to get into shape pdq – and I’m sure he’s very conscious of that.
Hence why he’s gone for all that experience … he feels there’s more chance of his target being achieved with people he feels he can trust to do a day’s work.
Fellers,
I’ve just been watching a stream depicting a large monkey going into a temple in India and sitting down to meditate for 10 minutes. Even with peanuts placed at its side, it remained undisturbed and just sat in complete concentration.
Nice piece on Keinan Davis here…
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-germany-steve-bruce-13371902
If he is so much in Bruce’s eyes (as seems to be the case) then I rather suspect that we’ll see him and Green a fair amount. And Jack?
“Villa Getting Older…But Better?”
In answer to JC’s question, definitely older, but right to have a big question mark after “better”. Of course, we have to wait for that answer, nothing like the test of competition.
It would be great to see the likes of Keinan Davis and Andre Green perform well for Villa. They must be hungry to do well. In my view, younger players could be key to Villa advancing this year. If they’e good enough, they’re old enough is a fair statement I’ve read on here before. If they’re not good at Championship level, they won’t do well in the PL. I think KD and AG will be good enough.
JL- why do so many other teams in this league have so many young players? and as for deflating easily what about our seniors last season? or the season before? not exactly sparkling examples of coping there. Whenever I have seen the youngsters get a chance they approach it with some vitality and little fear, where it goes wrong is the players around them are fearful and cautious.
Davis is our best hold up player I could see him playing with Kodjia or Hogan
Todays games or not if we lose
First up, the Villans are up against MSV Duisburg – newly promoted to the Zweite Bundesliga, the second ladder of German Football after winning the Dritte Liga. If Villa win, they will play at 3pm, but if they lose, they will face the losers of the Malaga v Berlin at 2pm.
Aston Villa v MSV Duisburg 12 noon UK – 45min game
Hertha Berlin v Malaga 1 pm UK – 45min game
3rd v 4th place play-off 2 pm UK – 45min game
Final 3pm UK – 45min game
This kicks off at 7am for you guys in the ET and 4am for you lot in PT.
Callum O’Hare and Harry McKirdy could go a long way to soving our goal scoring both are creative and poachers, O’hare is fierce when comes to harassing the opposition, the perfect 10 if you want a hard working side and a great provider, put him in behind Hogan and lets see what happens.
The team that is bubbling up at the moment in the U23’s is maturing physically, Davis has gone from boy to man in 6 months, so for me its time to get them in and then bruce can claim it was his plan all along 🙂
then go and buy Johnson and Robinson back
JG- your dreams may come true 🙂
http://www.avillafan.com/26132/hutton-sheffield-wednesday/
Mark: “why do so many other teams in this league have so many young players? and as for deflating easily what about our seniors last season?”
Have I ever knocked the idea of building up from youth? That’s never not been my view.
But – as I keep on saying – the situation at Villa has been different to other clubs and I think we seem to overlook that. Mos of the young players now knocking at the door have unfortunately been brought up when the club was badly run. In my view Bruce’s approach is perfectly correct – – bringing in players of great quality and experience from outside will get rid of the old atmosphere once and for all i.m.o., and set the standard of attitude for the young players.
The players of last season were another type not from the “top class”. And I think we’ll see the difference now we’ve got these 4 new ones on board.
Well I can’t watch it from here in Switzerland, I get the message “The uploader has not made this video available in your country. ”
Great!
oldvilla
mk
hutton 33 no goals or assists at this level is shocking
Nice to see Hogan score a couple. Green’s goal was a cracker.
Tell me more Iana – teams, scorers etc …… general play?
oldvilla
JG
As usual Hutton’s end product was woeful.
But, nice to see Hogan scoring & nice to see a bit of pace & comittment
Quite a lively game with Elmo certainly able to put himself about a bit and providing a goal.
Hogan grabbed two, which will keep him happy.
Who were the youngsters playing in numbers 17 and 29 in the Villa team? Promising.
OV (0-3)
Missed first 10 minutes. Like JL said, a lively 45 mins. Elmo provided chances, Hutton ran into dead ends. Passing could improve, but a young Villa side played with spirit.
Thanks Iana 🙂 Did Whelan play? And who was up front with Hogan?
Cheers for info, damn frustrating not being able to watch it 🙁
oldvilla
iang
caught some of match no names on shirts made it harder to pick out players,hogan looked like a striker, bit worried on think it was 31/2 min hogan broke from halfway line no villa player kept up, and yes hutton was his usual self all over place and no where ,crossing o my god
ov
try 7500 to holte i got on there, couldnt get in to mail site browser wouldnt open
OV
here’s some sort of commentary.
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/duisburg-vs-aston-villa-live-13372356
JL
Jake Doyle-Hayes & Calum O’Hare I think.
Steer, Hutton, Chester, Terry, Taylor, Elmohamady, Doyle-Hayes, Hourihane, Green, O’Hare, Hogan
IanG,
Thanks. “Jake Doyle-Hayes” is one I’ve not come across before. Short on experience, clearly, but looks promising.
V. interesting team selection.
OV
Here’s a better one with commentary & some video clips
https://7500toholte.sbnation.com/2017/7/23/16016252/aston-villa-enjoy-winning-start-to-cup-of-traditions
john l
sounds promising bruce will soon sort that out
Thanks everyone for the reports and links ………….. sounds an interesting team, lets see what team is up for the final. Blimey, I haven’t mentioned Villa and the word Final for a while lol ……..
oldvilla
OV,
I’m sure that’s not your ‘final’ word mate! 😉
well that was refreshing 🙂 as I said the kids are more dynamic and up for it, O’hares scrapped for the ball and cut it back to green for the first, Jake Doyle-Hayes has been playing in the development squad U18 and U23 a very special talent a CM playmaker think he’s about 17, maybe a bit young physically but has got talent in spades.
Elmo looks energetic and switched on, Hogan must think all his birthdays have come at once. Very open game and while the defence coped it was scrappy at times and JT got megged “megnuts” 🙂
cannot see it being that open in a real match though and they will be afforded more protection with Wheelan and Jedinak, I think Bree will like Elmo too.
JL- I think you are overplaying the way things are at Villa when it comes to the youth, I do not think they give a toss about that, they just want to play, certainly when I was a kid I wasn’t bothered or interested in the politics around me, just liked football, I think the kids are just fine without any intervention its the adults that have learnt bad ways.
For instants JL O’hare works like two men who taught him? gabby? 😉
think this next 45 will be a stiff test, hertha and Malliga decent sides
Mark,
Well, I think you are overplaying it the other way! 😉
Young players need inspiration from the older players to bring out their best – and it was lacking before. That’s my main point. I think we’re now in much better shape for the youngsters to take note of what’s required.
Elmo provided a vivid illustration just now in determination, but it was Jake Doyle-Hayes that gave him a lovely pass to provide Hogan. Lovely move.
Just watching the HB v Malaga match … Nothing to be afraid of there – apart from their handbags! 😀
Terrible attitudes.
OV not much consolation but you will probably be able to see the games on AVFC Youtube after the event the others are still available, Bit of a sod you would be impressed
JL- why do they possess such good attitudes already? Grealish is the only one who is a bit theatrical and I have been told this by someone who played with him and knows these Kids 😉
HB through 2-1. I think I saw a Malaga player being sent off when they were 1-up.
Competitive attitude, Mark, competitive.
We haven’t seen a truly competitive Villa team in yonks.
JL- no we haven’t John but then we haven’t played the kids much either and they have been winning tournaments etc quietly in the background unaffected by the 1st team, they are very competitive did you see Ohare tackle the keeper when Hogan just pulled up and let him have the ball? they have competitive attitude can’t understand why you think they haven’t its there in plain view IMO.
Good reports guys.
Just got in, seen the first hogan goal on twitter. Said the other day he reminds me of Deano if only he had service from the wings and boy did that finish remind me of deano
Elmo. Will cross all day,
team for final
Steer, Bree, Richards, Samba, Amavi, Bjarnason, Whelan, Lansbury, Grealish, McKirdy, Agbonlahor.
why is Richards playing? its not to sell him because if a team see’s him play they will lose interest
Mark – just please admit that you are the main agent for the kids and want a bigger fee! 😀
the villa players could do with a decent barber,ponytails,buns dyed tufts its just ridiclous
5 goals in less than 90 mins ,get out sun bruce youll get sun stroke
Samba and Gabby – now that’s experience for you! At least they know where the net is! 😀
JL- I will if you admit your an agent for the over 35’s and Bruce 😉
Developing a man crush on Samba, I think we could of saved £5m on terry, just as influential and marshal’s the back line superbly. Disappointed with the level of opposition but how gabby got away with those assaults I’ll never know. Bree should be nailed on to start too. Wheelan slow, really slow, can’t tackle but I knew that and a few stray passes but you can see his Role, get ball move it on, a slower Westwood. Hope he gets better in a few games because he will surely play. Jack was kicked to bits shame he hasn’t got a bit more pace he would avoid that.
Jack just not showing the killer energy for me, I’m afraid.
JL- no needs a bit more energy about him but its his first game back from injury
Well i enjoyed that.
Mark
Hertha finished 6th in the top german league!!
Nice to see a bit of passing, pressing and movement. Fair energietic performance for dads army.
Mckirdy struggled a bit. Liked it alot when lansbury got further forward and zipped balls into peoples feet.
Looked fairy fit overall, no idea of formation though!!
Cant we just pay richards up just to get him gone. Him and ross looking hard to shift.
Hutton and gg hopfully going!!
Yes mark, going to love samba. Terry samba and chester back 3….tho shall not pass!!
Andrew- they didn’t look up to much today, mind you Gabby was practising marshal arts on them. the energy all came from the youngsters bar Elmo and Hogan, thought Hourihane looked more comfortable with a more attacking game same with Lansbury. Mc Kirdy wasn’t really brought into the game with the ball gravitating toward Grealish, shame he’s a tricky little winger. First half it all went to Elmo and not so much green, thats the way it goes.
Gabby player of the Tournament!!
That’s what knowledge of martial arts … and experience! … gets for you.
Certainly was a bit edgy for a friendly! Good workout.
Looks like we have a few options. Good to hourihan looked better.
Fair play to gabby i guess. Looks fit and worked hard. Thats an improvement!!
Baker may be off
http://www.myoldmansaid.com/nathan-bakers-time-considers-future-face-interest/
JL- Thats funny because in a normal match he would of been sent off, to get a trophy do think the Germans were taking the pee
If we can just implement the plan of getting rid of 8 or 9 and bring these kids in the 1st team ill be so happy.
Andrew: “Good to hourihan looked better.”
Yes, I noted that. Had a good (deflected) strike on goal, too.
The team that was selected in the first match seemed to suit him better, I thought.
The Youngsters
Apart from the two that were played in the first match, I didn’t see a great deal that they offered today.
I think we have to assume that it’s mainly the seniors that will get the nod in the starting line-up. Mind you Bree may well get the nod in that and he’s hardly a senior at 19.
Player Ratings
I thought the first match ratings are about right…
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/how-aston-villas-players-rated-13373721
Doyle-Hayes gets 8 out of 10 and though I’d give him that for potential I’d say something slightly less for actual play, maybe 7.5. Though if forced I’d go with the 8.
my stream was a bit hazy but for gabys goal it looked a body check
mk
on baker he really never stood out,and by dads army signings not likely to get much time
JG- I believe Gabby stamped on the blokes ankle then put his shoulder into his chest before he noticed where the ball had gone 🙂
JL- I suppose you have to consider the players in both teams and their intent, first team had a solid defence, I would swap hutton for Bree. The first team didn’t contain a single defensive midfielder but they all worked tirelessly to close down which worked on the whole enough for the strong defence to stand up. They were way more attacking in intent than the second line up.
The second teams performance was much more like our normal stuff with the bree having to play CB the ball never got to the wings so Mckirdy a passenger, Davies ran about a lot but never got the ball played to him much either. Wheelan and Lansbury passed to each other a lot. No right winger at all and lots of trying to run the ball up the field by Jack.
I hope to see more of the first teams style, I definitely think Davis and Mckirdy would fair better in the first set up maybe even Jack and Lansbury. So rather than saying they were not up to much I think they were playing a stronger Hertha side anyway with a less progressive team based on effort rather than passing and guile.
What really stood out in the last game was Wheelan rarely crossed the half way and plied his trade in our Half unlike the first half team who got the team up the pitch a lot more. maybe it was the opposition? but looked more like personnel and patterns of play.
Lot of love for Whelen in twitter world. The player Westwood wants to be and iris xavi!!
Could be a crucial player for us. We may win without Jedi!!
Mark,
While I certainly agree with most of your first para (except I thought that the two defences looked roughly the same in ability), I’m not at all certain about the others, except you’re right that the guile element was missing in Team Two.
For me, Elmo looked twice the player that McKirdy was (who was in the wing position), and showed composure – an element missing amongst a lot of younger players, for understandable reasons. And composure is one of the factors we need to display to ensure success this season.
And as for HB’s strength – for me they didn’t look much better than Villa’s first opponents – especially after they went behind.
In short, experience and composure wins over youth every time for me – at this time. But that would be no surprise to you. 😉
After the negative reaction of losing to Shrewsbury or who ever it was nice to hear some positivity. Mainly style of play issues. Looked a lot better. Again beating the 6th best team in Germany ain’t bad going!!
I have no worries over youth…it’s just not an issue. Not sure why we are talking about it. Buck bets ten not many teams will field more home grown players than us this season. Speaking of which when’s rhm back!?
Our average age of squad is 27.5. On a par with most other clubs.
Sheffield wed highest at 28.5.
Ours should only go down after the cull too
Andrew I saw our average the other day its 29.5? believe it or not most other clubs last season were 24-25 average age thats quite a lot of difference. Newcastle didn’t field one player over 30 and some teams had one maybe two over 30, Huddersfield did but there average age was the lowest in the league. Ours will come down with the addition of the youth players but with all the ones we are trying to sell its high.
andrew
no way is whelan the irish xavi, more like a taller westwood
JG – well at least he’s taller I suppose
JL- On the defences, first one had no DM the second one did but Richards went off and Bree played CB while thor went to RB, dont think they are comparable really IMO but they didn’t concede mainly because of the man mountain and bree sweeping up.
Hertha put us under the cosh after the first goal for quite a while, never happened in the first game that I saw?
I think if you took the youth off of the pitch you would see a return to the walsall game, Emo had players running off him and Hogan was able to play as a striker not a jack of all trades because those around him were getting stuck in. I think you would be quite surprised if you put a solely shall we call it oldies side out. If Bruce does not watch the first game back and think hang on a minute, I give up.
Mark
Checked again. It’s 27.6. No idea how to put the table on here from twitter?! It’s high same average as blues, wed highest.
James
Well at least whelen puts himself about. I try not to think about finger pointer Westwood, makes me ill.
A little thing but could be a big thing.
Terry had to go up and lift the crappy cup as captain but waited and called over Chester and made him lift it with him.
I like it
Andrew- I just counted 17 players over the age of 27 unless the rest are all 16 I would be surprised if its 27.5 which is still high.
even if four of those over 27’s go we only want 24 players in the squad 19 senior players
You can have a squad of players 25 -29 and the average age would be about 27.5 or you can have players from 17-36 and the average age is 27.5 (which I doubt) one team has a load of players in their prime the other can have like us a load over 27-36.
Mark: “Hertha put us under the cosh after the first goal for quite a while”
Here we go again! I saw no evidence of being “under the cosh”! I saw the HB again as not being at all difficult, especially after scoring.
But we see thi9ngs differently – as always! 🙂
Correction “…I saw the HB game as not being at all difficult…”
BTW, the term “being put under the cosh” used to mean having salvos been fired at your team from all angles. I hardly remember HB shooting on goal (and none dangerously), apart from one free kick.
Who really cares about the average age if they will win for us? They can average at 40 for all I care as long as they win for the club.
And as for the best of our two teams today – there is no real comparison as the two teams we played were different. Berlin were much more together and professional which you would expect and needed to be played differently to the first rabble ……….
There are signs of progress, signs of youth and experience combining, signs of players starting to believe in themselves…………………… lets just let it grow and keep fingers crossed that in a months time we can smile just a little bit …….
Yours in hope, oldvilla
Do you believe in the Villa? ………
JL- you need better glasses mate 😉 had a look for a report thats not me 🙂
“Hertha Berlin reacted well to the goal putting the pressure on the Villa back line and won a slew of corners. All of which came to nothing. Villa tried to counter off them — but gave away the ball a few times.”
https://7500toholte.sbnation.com/2017/7/23/16016506/champions-aston-villa-win-silverware-in-germany
Great observations…I’ve probably repeated a few, but a post-match review is up.
OV- I’m smiling mate 🙂
nobody cares about the average age but there is a sweet spot with fitness/speed/experience or players being at there prime, most teams that succeed have the majority in that 24-29 bracket not like us with a big part of the squad over thirty wonder what the oldest team to win the prem or the champs was?
As I said – I don’t care what others have done or what we are doing …. as long as it works for AVFC.
oldvilla