Whilst the game against Newcastle United yielded a less than historic performance, an increased steel to Aston Villa’s team – especially in defensive areas – is a welcome change from past evidence.

Last season, the same two fixtures played yielded zero points. This season, Villa have four and, for a brief spell, were top of the league, though that was more a function of timing of games than much else.

If there’s an area where there’s concern at present, it has to be up front. Whilst injuries have meant that Christian Benteke and Libor Kozak are not available at present, there needs to be more lethality in attacks, and the evidence so far this season indicates that there’s much room for improvement – Andreas Weimann risked cards as he appeared to get angry at refereeing decisions, and Gabby Agbonlahor struggled to play the lone striker role.

In reality, much of the attacking issues come from a combination of injuries and square pegs in round holes. Taking Agbonlahor for example, here is a player who undoubtedly plays better in a front two, though Paul Lambert’s 4-3-3 based formations mean the Birmingham-born forward has struggled.

Weimann also appears less than effective in a wide role, with the Austrian international seemingly out of position, and often looking out of ideas.

Maybe the solution for Villa means a switching of personnel as the system – at least in principle – is a very solid one to play. The question, of course, is whether Villa have the funds to make those changes, and how long they may take.

So, for Villa fans, a point may not be the three some had hoped for, but a solid defensive performance is certainly a step in the right direction, along with an increased desire to distribute short from Brad Guzan.

Villa aren’t quite there yet, and the game lacked real chances, but there are signs that the club are headed in the right direction through sheer determination and a couple of new signings.

Comments 239

  1. Taking of our most creative player, at home, in a game we could for an ultra defensive mid sums our manager up. He’s the most anti football manager I’ve ever seen and I never thought Eck could be beat to that, but he has. We spent all the game with a double decker bus parked in our half and some twat in red boots wearing the a number 11 shirt trying to join in

    When Siisy came of, could have left Delph and LB and bought Grealish on, but nope, bring on a 6ft4 lump instead

    So baker and Sanchez were Lamberts inspired substations today to try and get this club 3 points. Feck off out of here

    Hull game is actually very important now. We need 7 points with Pool, Arsenal, Chelsea and Manu all in September

  2. Taking Zog off was wise.I believe he would have been sent off if he had not bee removed.Silly late challenges.A good move.
    Baker,I agree, he makes me anxious,just seeing him come on the field.

  3. Take him off, fair enough, bit not for a defensive mid. Of we were winning then yes, but we could of won

    Cole, Grealish and Bacuna could have gave us something different. Wiemann is just painful playing wide

    Even West Ham are playing football now which is annoying. Changed that it 2 months. Lamberts had 2 years. They have teddy teaching there attackers? Can’t we do the same ?

    Really hope there’s truth to new owners in soon.

    I think we have a good foundation. Back four, Sanchez and Delph could be solid. We need Benteke back but we better get someone like Sinclair, Chadli, Young, Gnabry in. Desperate

  4. JL

    NUFC and Stork “trying to find themselves” aren`t we also?

    4 points versus teams who took 12 from us last season?

    I know it doesn`t suit the narrative to say anything positive,but we are solid so far.No shot on target,ditto NUFC last week at home agianst Man City-a very good side I admit.

    If we do well or OK,then we are rubbish, it`s the other side having an off day.If we do badly we are rubbish.
    I read all week,every day that AVFC,Aare useless,tactics,signings,management, ,players,board,,PR,,team selections.Yet when we serve up average or poor performances the team are slated.Surely if we are that bad then ,why the shock and outrage,after all we are shit aren`t we?

  5. The clean sheet today masks the fact that Newcastle missed many clear chances. As such I don’t agree hat Villa’s defence has improved significantly. There are less calamitous players now but it really is an ugly spectacle to watch, and 2 to 3 nil would have been a fair reflection of the opposition’s superiority.

    Lambert said they were fantastic. My mind cannot comprehend what he would classify as a poor display.

  6. B6 agree completely.

    Paul

    Just read lamberts comments and thinking the same. How the hell are we always excellent! 00 at home. Is ok, not excellent, maddens me!!

    Im delighted with 4 points out of first 2 games. More than i expected. I do expect a win against hull at home though.

  7. what’s a clear chance? isn’t the goal keeper there to be beaten and if he isn’t he’s done his job and the striker hasn’t . if the striker doesn’t make the keeper work at all or hit the target what right does he have to claim a win? if nzogbias free kick had been on target the keeper was nowhere but it wasn’t. if every shot was like an arrow everyone would score, they don’t. last week gabby missed an open goal another clear chance? there’s a chance they go in and a chance they don’t. sometimes it flukes in its all in the game. both teams were poor in front of goal and god forbid we gave the opposition an opportunity to shoot at our goal that shouldn’t happen in a game of football surely? neither team were clinical it was a draw.

  8. Credit where it’s due, Senderos is a great passer of the ball. His lack of pace will be exposed against a decent striker though. Sissy looks an excellent piece of business, Hutton for me was by far the best player in the 1st half and probably MoM. Sanchez looks so much better than I could have hoped. Especially when u think of how long it usually takes players to settle in a new country. He looks a very happy type of fella. Agree with Frem, back 5 and Sanchez is as good as we can hope for and those 6 are as good as any other teams players outside the top 4.

    For me Grealish has to start as does Joe Cole. For the most part I thought KR was awful with some unbelievable wayward passes. Weimann at least battled, Gabby was awful, Z’Og was ok but needs to keep his head and also needs to be returned gently. Play him every game after a year out and he’ll be injured by mid Sept.

    It’s frightening to see how poor baker looked, after all the games he played last year. He was probably our main CH last year…yikes, how did we survive?

    Anyway, if Benteke is back by Oct 1 we don’t need to sign anyone. Let’s face it, if we’re not adventurous against the toon, we’ll have 11 men behind the ball for the 5 games after Hull

  9. You could see how we were trying to play yesterday. We held our shape much better and the players seemed to have a much better understanding of where their team mates would be.
    When Sanchez was brought on, my first thought was that it was defensive and wrong. On quick reflection though, we had been under pressure for the whole of the second half and needed to nullify their attacks to give ourselves a chance to build some ourselves. Indeed we started then coming back into the game.
    It reminded me why the manager gets paid for doing his job and I get paid for doing mine.

  10. B6 NUFC and Stork “trying to find themselves” aren`t we also?

    Oh, yes – all I was doing was saying that the 4 points we’ve collected so far is against teams that are not going to give us the worst headaches. In other words we can’t be too happy with what’s been accomplished so far this season – except with regard to the defence and (partly) the midfield.

    We need to get some shots on goal – even last week’s goal was partly a keeper error.

  11. Agreed with B6 – I’m not hopping with delight but those first two games are very pleasing in that we have two clean sheets and four points.

    Very positive about Sissy and Hutton being solid at the back and dangerous going forward. Cissokho’s crosses are on the money – I can’t wait for Benteke to be in the box for a few of those coming in.

    Frem makes one good point – what the point of having dudes like Cole and Grealish – who can ‘unlock’ a defence – and not use them in a nil-nil at home? Especially to a ropey looking Newcastle side who have yet to find their feet.

    I thought it’d be Cole/Grealish for Zoggy which would’ve allowed Weimann into the middle.

    Even using the subs he did – the order looked odd to me. Lambert took off Zoggy (front three) for Sanchez (midfield three) and then – 15 mins later – put Bent (front three) for Richardson (midfield three). I wonder why he did that as I didn’t notice us using a 4-4-2 for 15 minutes. It’s one of those ones where someone who knows everything about tactics could explain but I can’t see it.

    Gabby and Weimann weren’t great. Weimann did a lot off the ball but still – warming to Frem’s theme but not his excitement – I’d have taken Gabby off for Bent and Zogbia off for Cole or Grealish.

    Anyway – looking forward to the tough games coming up. I won’t be expecting many points but I will be expecting that we’re not such pushovers as last two years.

  12. I’m nonplussed that everyone’s so happy about the first two games! We seem to be trying to find +ves that were largely not there unless you sum it up in one word – ‘defence’.

    THIS was the first home match of the season and yet only 28,000 Villa supporters turned up. Since when did this happen before on the first day of the season? And these brave fans were rewarded with no shots on goal. The best they got was 2 close shaves from Zoggy.

    After the play in the last 3 seasons, then I suppose I can see where everyone is coming from in their happiness, but it looks as though we’ve already forgotten how things used to be at Villa Park!

    Villa were crying out for a player to unlock the barcodes’ defence … but we saw none. Anything to prevent defeat seems to be the mentality just now.

    Yes, it can improve, but I wait with baited breath.

  13. Lamberts assessment of Gabby’s non-performance was bizarre and untruthful, “just lacking touch” a remark that has cropped up for ten seasons, face it Lambert, every manager has a player who will get him the sack sooner or later, Gabby’s yours, and good luck to him.

  14. The last thing I did last night was watch Villa play Newcastle and then read some of the posts on AVL. It certainly had an effect at the subconcious level. Next thing I’m in a dream where I’m part of the Villa squad I’m going to be tried out at right back and alternated with Alan Hutton. Hutton has just had a good game against Newcastle and I’ve been picked for the next game. Anyway, I’m worried because I can’t play football to save myself. I used to mostly play rugby, except for one year where I played on the wing for the Ist XI at school, didn’t come to much. I feel I’m not up to playing for Villa. I’m too old and not fit enough. Then next thing it’s a sunny afternoon at Villa Park and I’m doing the prematch warmup and it doesn’t feel so bad. Lord knows whats going on with my head, but I look across to the right between the Trinity and North Stands and they’re constructing a full scale replica of the Parthenon at Villa Park. That’s all I remember:):). It’s crazy, I know.

  15. Jl
    We seem to have half a team at the moment and a reluctance use what attacking options we have. Lambert has said we will bring in 2 attacking options and maybe some will go. If i was a betting man id say he’s looking to take this ultra defensive stance for the upcoming top six teams . after which tekkers should be back and the options broaden . i think people are pleased we may have something to build from and not on the overall display and the points help

  16. Mark,

    You’re most likely right, except that some have been chortling how we have 4 points and inferring that this is really good.

    My post just now was to counteract that over-optimism by simply stating the bare-faced truth of how we came by those 4 points.

    Since the Barcodes’ lack of confidence up front caused them to miss 2 clear chances at least, then I’d say that the defence is not that good to face these so-called toughies coming up, save that Sanchez might be saving grace. If they HAD scored I wonder what Villa’s manager would have done?

  17. Jl

    that’s the kicker, I was wondering that myself. the injury kind of set the mood for his changes and you could tell it was point gained and not two lost.
    I think the orient game will be perfect to try okore with vlaar and sanchez in front because as well as senderos has done he lacks pace and that could kill us against quicker forwards. I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw 5 at the back in those games (liverpool etc) ,plus sanchez, I really wouldn’t. Also I think we will see bent and grealish get a start against orient Richardson at left back. although he’s just as likely to play weiman and gabby in the hope they get some form going (some hope) .

    I hope he uses it as a positive to see how could look on the front foot and not bottle it for fear of losing. and don’t forget there is a two week gap before liverpool and a possible 2 new signings to choose from then with an outside chance of benteke getting a run towards the end of sept

  18. JL
    I also don’t buy the should of thing with chances its either do or don’t, the variables are so many that a chance is a chance and no more. you would say a penalty is a sure thing but it rarely is, its a test of skill and character, as all chances are if your lacking your lacking, we missed several against stoke and one fluked in that’s how it goes.

    In villa’s defence we have gained 4 points against two teams everyone see’s as better than us without an effective front line. whereas at the end of last season we had neither defence or attack and the results showed this, so something has changed and its not just other teams being rusty, because we are all in the same boat and are boat has more holes. we were hardly spectacular in pre-season

  19. Mark,

    You’re right on all counts, but they don’t change my p.o.v.

    As to the chances missed by the Barcodes, though, my reference was of course to the fact that a confident attack (probably all of those we’re meeting in those 6 tough matches) would have put those chances away. That’s the worry.

  20. why is it taking kosack so long to come back,normally broken legs dont take 8 months,if gabby wiemen cant score in the cup there time is up loan them out with rest lamberts dummies team for hull same back 5 as yesterday sanchez westwood zog delph grealish bent in a 4 2 3 1 with delph middle of 3pushed on

  21. JL

    but surely you would expect them too? they are 40m plus players so their skill level is greater. surprisingly we have a good record against the top teams with a worse defence. If we had benteke on form I wouldn’t be surprised if we picked up points, arsenal are just as lucky to be on the same points as us on their first two games.

    when we beat man city they had 25+ chances we had 12, 4 on target they had 7. we won 3-2 with a team everyone was dreading seeing this season and kosak played not benteke. will this continue we will have to wait and see

  22. Last season we got zero points from those games, this time we got four.

    Now of course that doesn’t mean we will improve on every result from last season, and nor does it mean we are world beaters.

    However, we have four points. Depending on one’s attitude, it can be called resilient, lucky or any number of things.

    Whatever it is, in my view, is unimportant.

    Even at our zenith of recent years, we were not supreme passers of the ball, and neither were we an assured possession team so I’ll be honest and say I’m wondering where the marker is we are being matched against.

    Yes, there are issues – our attack is anaemic – but, despite that, we have four points.

    I said in my pre-game column for the Express and Star that a point against Newcastle would be a solid performance. Sure, if like to win every game but, as people know, we have issues that take time to fix, and when Benteke is back I expect that attack to be sharper.

    Also, re the Sanchez move, why is that considered defensive? Charlie went off, Richardson moved from the central role he was playing on to the wing, and Sanchez took his place in the middle – it wasn’t a change of anything, defensive or offensive, it was just changing personnel…

  23. For the record, I’d have made the same sub. However, I’d probably have taken Gab and Andi off and brought Bent and Grealish on if I had the chance though that would have had us on ten men when Aly went off.

    Smash and grab football is nothing new for Villa, O’Neill played it and got us sixth so, in people’s view, when did we last try and play passing football? I remember spells under Houllier where we tried but ultimately one could argue being given £24m for Bent dug Houllier out of the same holes every other manager has been in – ie, bottom five.

    Just interested in where some of the criticism comes from. I appreciate, for some, Lambert is beyond any form of ability to change view on him or his style, but I didn’t see anything yesterday that wasn’t any different to some of O’Neill’s games in charge.

    Early days this season, but I feel far more solid as a team this season vs last.

    A small improvement? Maybe, but when you’re a Villa fan in current circumstances, you’ll take progress in any form if it continues over time…

  24. Matt: Yes, there are issues – our attack is anaemic – but, despite that, we have four points.

    Here we go again! 🙂

    Yes, fine … but you are saying that an opening game of the season bringing in 28k fans and no shots on goal is fair dos for the sake of gaining 4 points?

    I’m shocked at that p.o.v. Matt. OK, if you hold that pov, you hold it, but you are effectively accepting mediocrity.

    I’d prefer to say that there are signs that the defence is mostly sorted (and I welcome that) and that therefore there is a base to work from. But we have to wait some games yet before we see what is to transpire.

    But to have a season’s opener offering such low faire against an average team and it being accepted just shows how far we have sunk as a club.

  25. matt

    I think the template is the so called lesser teams such as swansea and southampton or even wigan that play possession football. they’ve shown it can be done on a budget. unfortunately its taken them a long time to get there and villas supports expectations are such that we think we can do it overnight and with Lamberts tactics never.

  26. JL

    yes you have as have many of us but yours has a slightly too negative feel to it for your good self , have you been in the cafe with steamer? 😉

  27. “John:I’m shocked at that p.o.v. Matt. OK, if you hold that pov, you hold it, but you are effectively accepting mediocrity.

    We are mediocre John, at least in Premier League team terms, and have been for years.

    We can argue it should be better. We can say we deserve better. We can be happy or sad.

    Regardless though, we are where we are, and I’ve yet to find a time in my own life where expecting more in the face of not being able to get it does anything positive.

    Prime example could be my past health issues or Amy’s present one. No doubt both of us wanted to be better, or felt we deserve to be on some level, but we weren’t/aren’t.

    Like everyone else, I’m a product of my experience and my attitude is reflective. I don’t hold that my view is either right or wrong – it is a view, nothing more – but it influences my angle.

    Could we have done better? Yes. Could we have done worse? Aye.

    The discussions are endless – a good thing as it promotes dialogue – but the truth is that progress from years of financial mismanagement takes time. Building a team takes time, and there will be many mediocre and inconsistent steps in between.

    Sure, you can chop and change, but will that get any better short term? For me, and until there’s a different owner – or at least a different financial and strategic view – change is just added entropy, not a fix that helps us.

  28. Mark,

    Swansea, as you say, took years to do it – 14 years ago they had the flexibility to take risks and build, much like PL did at Norwich or Adkins at Southampton. Adkins also had the benefit of one of the most prolific academies in the country too.

    Sure, we can start building a passing game up but, like Wigan’s ultimate fate, it carries risks – how many fans, honestly, would be happy to wait the three or four years, potentially including relegation, to build for such a vision?

    I have my doubts there would be many if that tactic was adopted at any level further than theoretical – Houllier was far from loved by the fans and needed £24m to buy a striker to pull us out the bottom five…

  29. Negative, negative, how dare you.

    Personally i think we’ve had some very good debates over the past couple of days, James Gill for instance asked why Kozak has been out for 8 months with a broken leg, the fans ought to be told things like this.

    Irrespective of any perceived improvement this season, and when you take into consideration the pre season games, then i doubt if their has been any, the undeniable fact is that probably only three or four players are up to the standard that Villans expect. The record of transfers by Lambert and Keane is diabolical during their managerial careers. Lambert signed nearly 30 for Norwich in under three seasons, most still form the basis of their current team in the Championship, Keane signed 36 for Slumberland and most have been booted, take into consideration his dealings at Ipswich and its obvious that player recognition isn’t exactly a strong point with the duo.
    Expectation among our support hasn’t been this low for donkey’s years, we expect crepe and Lerner and Lambert supply it. Hopefully help will be coming in December and this shower will just be a distant, yet painful memory.

  30. Mark, Matt, et al

    Me negative? Never? I just evaluate things based on going down to VP for 64 years and assessing the value of what we have now to even 45 years ago (1969).

    There appears to have been a ‘something’ that has been lost amongst Villa fans and it’s difficult to put a finger on it.

    It could be that the nearest word to describe it is ‘pride’. Whereas in 1968 fans had enough and let the management know in no uncertain terms, today it seems to be thought that it’s not important enough.

    And that, relative to what else is happening in the world today, is perhaps the right stance.

  31. Who knows – maybe my circumstances in life have led me to a patience level that is too patient for Villa, or the general world of football.

    Do I want success? Yes. Am I foolish enough to expect it short term? No way.

  32. John,

    I don’t think you are negative any more than I think Mark is positive.

    We all have our opinions and they are formed in our own ways. To say someone is negative or positive would be far too facile in my eyes as I know many of you outside of Villa terms and know you, as a collective, are far more diverse than a view on Villa might suggest.

    We’re all frustrated and that’s understandable. I guess what matters to each of us in different terms and, as a result, the discussion will likely be infinite in length.

    Which, considering this is a site for discussion, is a good thing…

  33. ”Smash and grab football is nothing new for Villa, O’Neill played it and got us sixth so, in people’s view, when did we last try and play passing football?”

    Matt and in this is our underlying problem as a club

    You can throw millions at kic n rush counter attack football and it will only take you so far
    all this chasing around will have a bad affect on the sqaud as the season progresses

    I now Lambert will not change his style but at least he could try and play the right players in the right areas at the right time a bit more to make the team more positive and funtional

    Saying all that i think we have enough to stay up which is all i can hope for right now — and dispite the anti football i points are always most welcome

  34. Absolutely Runtings – I would prefer something more fluid.

    Yesterday I saw hints of that – less kicking long and more from the full backs – but it will take time and players.

    Is Lambert able to do that? Maybe, maybe not but I think there’s a few positives I can take from the first two games which, hopefully, won’t be ruined a few months from now.

  35. Matt,

    With respect – having no shots at goal and only 28k fans turning up is not an opinion. It’s a fact! 😉

    Otherwise I’d agree with every word you’ve stated.

  36. When i look at the premier lge i see almost every team playing a passing game and i feel villa have been the only team to miss the boat on the fact the game has progressed from the out and out direct styles of the past.

    Why always us

    t’s not just lambert we have been doing this for years

  37. John,

    Stats are correct, of course, but no more correct than the points one.

    Reality is many have lost interest due to the struggles – can’t blame them as I’ve had games I’ve not wanted to go to at times – so that explains the lower crowd.

    Chances were low because I don’t think we had a player capable of finishing them off. Had Bent got a bigger work rate than a rock, I’d have started him ahead of Weimann and put Gabby wide.

  38. Agree with many comments on the game yesterday. JL , most of our present fans were not even alive in1968.

    After all the comments before the season started, and how sh**e Hutton is/was. He has turned out to be Villa’s outstanding player in the last three matches, and if they all show the same determination, we should be ok. The defense is now solid, which is what we want, and the rest of the team are not being chopped and changed, which is what Lambert did previously. They need to gel, for the forthcoming onslaught. I agree we could use other players, other formations, but maybe RK/PL are looking for damage limitation for next 5/7 matches, and then with a team that has got used to playing together, you can start changing the odd player

  39. Matt: Stats are correct, of course, but no more correct than the points one.

    I think that really goes without saying, Matt, and I think you’re overlooking the fact that I’m quite happy that 4 points is good, and the defence is an improvement, in the context of what’s been happening these last few years.

    But I am not happy that the management at Villa have led the fans down the garden path for so many years having promised the earth when they first came. “European championship football within 5 years” comes to mind, and certain famous slogans like “Proud History, Bright Future”.

    And, now, to have 28k come down to VP (yes, a lot of fans have lost interest!) with the club failing to offer them better entertainment.

    If the club does consider the spectators to be customers then really they should expect fans to take the club to court for misrepresentation (of the product). In the normal world that’s what would happen. But we have become soft, and continue to have hope that things will get better. Well … they might. And you’re right – we don’t know where and don’t know when (as Vera Lynn crooned).

  40. Paul

    I totally agree with your outlook, but as I said before there were a couple of times yesterday when there were gaps created In Villa’s defence and chances available that a stronger (or more confident) team would have taken with glee.

    But we’ll see what happens next.

  41. John,

    Yes, lip service re the plan is nonsense as there wasn’t one that was sufficiently cohesive.

    However the chief executive is gone and the owner is trying to sell up, so isn’t that mostly moot now?

    Maybe I’m not expecting enough, maybe others are expecting top much – flip sides of the same coin.

    Question though John – to what do you attribute our massive crowds in the third division and low ones now? Nature of society or a change of perception about who or what Villa are? Be interested to hear your thoughts given your long and deep historic connection to the club.

  42. Matt,

    (Thanks for perhaps a tad over-flattering lead-in…!)

    Times have changed … no doubt. We have seen a huge change in the nature of football. In the 70s/80s we still had heavy footballs and plenty of terraces, and I think the removal of terraces (and the wooden-floored Trinity Road stand) has taken away much of the old feel of going to a match.

    Added to all that is the development of the Premier League and hyper-inflated player salaries that have removed the players from the fans’ orbit. The fans could once connect with the players, and it was Villa’s programme editor Rob Bishop who once made the comment to me that it had been virtually impossible to have a truly honest off-the-cuff encounter with the players since 1996.

    I’m not going to say to what I owe the differences between now and 40+ years ago as I don’t really know, but I do suspect that the loss of the fans/player identity is a major factor. Fans no longer feel connected as they did back then. In the 1970s a fan could feel a change in the pulse of affairs and think he was part of it.

    That’s my pennu’th. I hope it helps!

  43. Trinity,

    That’s a leading question. From the late 60s there were many problems with fans which led to fencing being erected, and that was certainly a product of the 1960s as personal and social discipline became far more lax, and after the players’ maximum wage was removed (1961), which may have influenced matters, though I’m not sure about that.

    My happiest time as a fan was when I was young and regular supporter (aged 12-19, between 1956 and 1963) when there was still the good-natured and respectful banter between fans and police and the opposing team. I experienced that home and away without exception. Yes, that was really a happy time and the general community spirit was very strong then because of the good behaviour you knew you could expect.

    They were very good times.

    I rarely had time to visit VP after 1963, so my awareness of community issues in football since then is rather vague.

  44. Hello people

    Villa’s crowd for the first home game in 1980-81, when we went on to win the league, was 25,000 and that game wasn’t been shown live on TVs all over Birmingham!

    It’s not a new problem. The days when fans packed out Vila Park regardless of how we were playing, and who we were playing, were over before then.

    I’m an anomaly in that other than a couple of seasons when circumstances made it difficult for me to get to every game, I haven’t missed too many home matches in that period. Generally, I think people want more for their money and there have been a couple of generations of Villa supporters who are far more discriminating about which matches they will attend.

  45. Andrew Villa’s crowd for the first home game in 1980-81, when we went on to win the league, was 25,000 and that game wasn’t been shown live on TVs all over Birmingham! …It’s not a new problem.

    Correct. But my comments were intended as in the context of times since the Premier League started, Andrew. I suspect it’s quite a few years since we had a low gate of 30k as the opening crowd of the season, though it could have happened just before Lerner arrived in 2006.

    It’s worth pointing out though that the 1980-81 figures (all the way through) were not high because of the recession pervading at the time and which affected the Birmingham area very badly. That was really the cause of Doug Ellis’s cut-backs when he came back as chairman in 1982.

  46. Andrew: The days when fans packed out Vila Park regardless of how we were playing, and who we were playing, were over before then.

    To continue … I think that if you were to examine the figures for the late 70s they were much higher, and dropped (as stated above) as a result of the recession.

  47. I don’t disagree John and I also think the reality that visits to football matches in those days weren’t for the faint-hearted contributed. But remember back then Villa were on the up and football was still a relatively cheap pastime, and, as I say, if you wanted to watch Villa the only way you were going to see a game was by going to Villa Park.

    Undoubtedly, money is tight for a lot of people at the moment too, and yesterday you had a choice: you could have paid £30 or whatever for a match ticket or you could have watched the game on a big screen somewhere for the price of a couple of beers,

  48. I made a comment yesterday that i like judge the game on what i have seen, i should add relative to recent showings. Comparing where we are to our history will just piss you off and considering we expect a sale and change of reigeim is pointless . i would be railing against the wrong person/organisation . its akin to telling the barman he needs to up his sevice when he’s leaving at the end of the week

  49. Andrew,

    I agree, but the low attendance yesterday would appear to be as a result of loss of interest in AVFC following the proceedings of the last 3 years.

    The latest recession started about 2008 but it has taken until now (when the economy has improved) for a large dip in STs to be noted. I’d suggest that if Villa were a big enough force there would have been more than 35,000 there yesterday.

  50. Mark: Comparing where we are to our history will just p*ss you off

    Yep, I’d agree with that. But since Villa is still the major club in the West Midlands (and even the whole Midlands) we should be exhibiting our status and not pretending to be like Hull City.

  51. Also isn’t expecting someone else to fork out loads of money to bolster your own sense of pride say more about us as people? As matt alluded where We are and where we think we should be are two different things ask any football fan. If winning is all to you you’d be better looking elsewhere than villa for a short term fix . doesn’t mean we shouldn’t want more it just needs to be tempered by reality Birmingham isn’t london etc hence none of our clubs are successful in modern terms

  52. John. I’m not sure we disagree at all here. Had Villa been taken over in the summer and spent 30 or 40 million on players, and had the game kicked off at 3 pm on Saturday and not been shown live on tv, I’m sure the crowd would have been bordering on sold out. We haven’t and it wasn’t, and I also agree with Mark that we just need to recognise the reality of where we are now and then make a judgment after Steamer’s second promised new owner takes over and makes his intentions clear.

    Other than the fact that we were completely toothless in attack I don’t think it was too bad yesterday. Our defence looks better organised, the bench looks stronger and the indications are that the midfield will improve with the introduction of Sanchez. Our attackers are horrible though. Benteke and Kosac can’t get back soon enough for me.

    It’s got to be time to draw a line under gabby’s Villa career. No one has been able to get a tune out of him since MON left. 36 League goals in MON’s last 3 seasons – not great but respectable – 21 goals in 4 and a bit seasons since. Tells its own story.

  53. OK with me Mark if that’s what it takes to get us a goal. He was still scoring one in three from the corned flag for MON. Now he looks like the fight’s gone out of him, like a geriatric Jack Russell who wants to tell his owner, you threw the stisk, fetch it yourself.

  54. Mark: If winning is all to you you’d be better looking elsewhere than villa for a short term fix .

    Are you referring to me, Mark?

    If so, you’re way off beam! 🙂

    What I say is that Villa is the flagship of the Midlands and always has been really. Why should the north and the south have all the glory – someone should be leading for the Midlands I would have thought. It would bring more attention to this part of the world.

  55. Mark, to add…

    What I am really saying is that Birmingham is a major conurbation area that should be properly represented in football. If Manchester and Liverpool can – and Everton is a Villa-like club in several respects – what is going wrong here that we can’t be at least biting on their heels?

  56. Jl

    no mate Its not aimed at you but the general idea that we are so wonderful someone should throw their fortune away to satisfy our sense of pride or lack of.
    I don’t know what it is about the Midlands but since its decline as a manufacturing giant has anything really replaced it? in a young millionaire sense of things, how attractive is the area? clearly not as much as the others mentioned. therefore it will take a lot of money to attract the big stars most people seem to crave and it isn’t thus far coming. I think we are reaching a point where we have 5-6 really well backed teams and they cant all win the 3-4 cups on offer and usually are only concerned with 2 anyway. I wonder how much room there is as the pot of money will only get so big, hence teams can easily implode trying to break in with the money route, we tried and courted disaster. what’s left is long term and needs people with the required skills, none of which are evident at villa apart from fox at the moment.

    by the way hows the man utd will come roaring back thing going for you? and boy did QPR get spanked 🙂

  57. Watching Eibar vs Sociedad on this new Sky Sports 5 channel…

    The passing ability and general fluidity of play as well as off the ball movement by a team with 6,000 fans who had a transfer budget of £140k puts us to shame. It’s quite embarrassing how far behind English players are in terms of technical ability.

    Perhaps regarding Villa’s woeful use of the ball going forwards it’s a case of “don’t hate the player, hate the game”….

    On the Newcastle match, we were poor. They were poor. We got lucky-er. However, decent signs that we’ve learned how to perform as a unit. That’s a step in the right direction, considering our defending ability of the last 2 years. Build from the back, and all that.

  58. Trin,
    Thanks for that mate, i love Aussie films, they produce good actors too, Jack Thompson, Brian ?? who married Rachel Ward, Lizzie out of Cell Block, Harold Bishop, Errol Flynn, Peter Finch, the bloke with the long fingernails ????, Harry Kewell all good actors.

    It could be that the nearest word to describe it is ‘pride’. Whereas in 1968 fans had enough and let the management know in no uncertain terms, today it seems to be thought that it’s not important enough.

    Very true John, we Brummies were on a mission to restore AVFC to the elite, only the super powers of Herbert prevented it and now Lerners kicking us while we’re down. Can’t get into this failure stuff at my age, didn’t watch or follow yesterdays game.

  59. josh

    “The passing ability and general fluidity of play as well as off the ball movement”

    spot on mate its what makes us look so amateurish in comparison to some teams especially in the final third but its been the case for years probably since o’dreary

  60. Great point Josh

    i think the attitude of most british players once they get a contact with a premier club is that they have made it and it’s now time to live the high life.
    Players from aboard seem to have a lot of players that are hungry to improve every area of there game and go as far as they can n the sport

  61. steamer
    how can you truly comment on whether we were any good then?
    so even when your generation had all this pride and stood up to the hierarchy you still aloud it to get to this shambles? shame on you.

  62. I do see the lge changing though in terms of most teams now plasying football

    thats the most worrying thing about villa for me as we can go down a few divisions for opposition and still get outplayed

  63. Mark,
    When Herbs returned i realised the Goose was cooked, no point, i stayed away until he left but he’d saved his most deadly Doug deed until last, selling to Randy Loser, what awaits us next ? can it be any worse ? next instalment in December ( Apparently ).

  64. steamer
    so your saying we should give up then? 😉
    yes it could most definitely be worse. all the teams that went on to build a dynasty had big characters that knew exactly what they needed to do. we had ours and binned him after we won the league? shankley, ferguson built clubs by force of character can we guarantee such a man will appear for us? not a chance but such is life you take your chances when they come as you never know what will happen just enjoy the ride whatever the outcome

  65. Mark,

    From all accounts there’s nowt much wrong with the West Midlands at present, with investment coming in strongly. JLR is doing phenomenally well as part of all that.

    In fact, why isn’t JLR our major sponsor?

  66. Mark,

    It’s not the top handfull we necessarily need to replicate but at least get to something like Everton’s status. Villa and they should be neck-and-neck if nothing else.

  67. JL

    question is if we are bought by big money then champs league etc will be the required standard so does that leave us hoping for mediocrity to emulate the Evertons of this world?

  68. Pity that MU are still trying to find themselves and S’land are at mid season form. Apparently £300,000 a week players don’t do it.

    Poor ol’ Martinez and don’t forget Harry another of my favourites.

  69. Just got back in from the Hull Stoke game. Stuck in with the Stoke fans ( again)

    I would have been extremely pissed if we didn’t beat them on the opening day after watching how dire they were against 10 men for 70 mins.
    Fair play to Hull, did well with 10 men. Could be a blessing in disguise for us. Wear them out today, they play again on Thursday. If we can’t win that home game then there are real problems. We need to win

    Grealish offered a 4 year contact. I’d tell Lambert to do one if I were him. Bought on Sanchez and Baker at home instead. Twat

  70. Oh, and being with the Stoke fans, Hull fans, seeing there both there stadiums, I’m glad I support the best team in the world

  71. JL

    With respect,I think it`s inportanrt to distinguish between being happy with 4 points and reasonably satisfied.I am in the latter camp.I don`t think anyone is happy with our start.Reasonablysatisfied is where I am at.Should we start an appeals process to give the 4 points back?Are we supposed to be downhearted.I just don`t comprehend how any positive,points,or simply anyrhing has to have the attachment “but we were lucky,but they are head and shoulders above us,but they had a bad day,but they should have won,but they are better than us,but…..There is a reluctance to accept any good fortune unless it is encased in pessimism,and gloom.Christ,I welcome the 4 points,we are not a great side,but I don`t feel the need to feel guilty about being satisfied that we haven`t been hammered yet.

  72. Mark king,

    You babble about what is defined as a clear chance or not. The fact remains that the Newcastle keeper made no saves of note. Guzan did and Newcastle wasted many more opportunities than Villa.

    I’m glad you’re still pleased by shit

  73. We certainly don’t Brasil but god knows what goes through Lamberts head. He still plays Wiemann on the wing who been dire there for a good year now

    I read a lot of blogs and twitter on Villa and everyone is saying the same. We need a winger before the window shuts desperately but I don’t trust lambert to address the problem. He loves his Shabby and Wiemann starting week in week out

    Hope this take over happens soon

    Good to see kea wasn’t in the squad. Hopefully on his way back to holland . No GG or Lowton in the squad either

  74. Frem, have you wondered if Lambert does want the players you keep on about only he is ham strung to some degree and the ones he could get are no better than the ones he has?

  75. JL

    That Parthenon in that weird dream I had did have a plastic look about it. I think if Villa loses the community, it’ll become a bit of a plastic club and eventually fade away. I do agree with you that the club needs to look to the past (ideals wise) to move ahead. It mustn’t forget its fan base, especially the local fan base. As far as global expansion is concerned, it’s been said many times before, but I’ll say it again, Villa needs to win something substantial. So, in the meantime, Villa need to get locals and UK based fans back to VP first. That’ll mean playing some good football. I can see PL has limited resources, so his hands are tied. He needs to get those substitutions right, though. I also was worried to see Baker come on. I would have gone for Cole to spark the attack. But I’m not the manager.

  76. Mark: this chap for me says it in a large nutshell [link to J Fear’s article]

    Mate, I don’t disagree with the views expressed by JF hardly at all except that I would express that statement of where we’re at in slightly different terms. But broadly I agree. In other words I broadly agree with your view as well!! 😉

    But whereas JF and you want to skirt away from the fact of 28k supporters attending first match and no shots on goal, I take those as centrally important issues (above almost anything else) as they’re symbolic of the disenchantment that now exists amongst the fans.

    The club needs its fans and (allied to the Lions’ clubs issues) the club’s management is still not doing itself many favours. Its policies these last few years has virtually disconnected many long term fans and they’re a very long way from getting them back on board i.m.o.

    But … as we keep on saying … let’s see what develops.

  77. B6

    I think my response to Mark above could be addressed to your post as well.

    I think the difference between us all is not a divergence of opinion on the status of 4 points but the underlying factors that are worrying – to me at least.

    But we shall see.

  78. Ian- if Lambert can’t find any players better than Gabby and Wiemann then we are in more of a dire situation then anyone could ever imagine.
    Sinclair, Chadli, Gnabry, Salah, Moses ( gone to Stoke) etc . We really can’t get one of them in to replace those two ? We have Grealish who could of played instead of Wiemann, Bacuna, bent could have replacement Gabby

    I think Lambert just loves them and actually thinks they are useful. I’ve seen guys in Sunday league football with more ability then those two have. Wiemann is a striker, a useless Winger and has been for a year now. He still plays there

  79. The Newcastle game showed just how far we have fallen behind a large chunk of the teams in this league.
    It was a turgid performance and we never looked like scoring even if we’d played til midnight. We looked more organised and solid at the back( not great but much better than last year).
    Our lack of creativity is worrying, and if not rectified will haunt us again this season, as a team we only scored something like 39 goals all season and conceded shitloads. We really need to beat Hull Sunday as after the international break we are up against it. Despite having 4 Pts, which is a decent return against two teams that easily beat us last year, we still need massive improvements or we will once again will be in the battle to avoid the drop.
    On a positive the Aston Tavern looks great

  80. Jl
    Of course low attendance is worrying but isnt it what most wanted especially steamer to get the message to the owner he’s messing with the wrong crowd? Change of owner will cure that if fox doesn’t first. Or even an upturn in play
    As for the no shots we have been there before, gabby and weiman are not going to get hatfuls at least nzogbia got on the end of some even if tbey went over or wide. If we do not get a forward then bent has to be played until tekkers or kosak is fit. Or even robinson or burke given a go but im not panicking yet. I hope we get the argie lad linked last week and a forward with pace we have until next monday.

    Steamer
    Me and brother used to watch doctor who from behind thr settee with my dad telling us what’s happening its not the same

  81. B62- when we play 451 and put 11 men behind the ball I’d expect us to look more solid. The worrying thing is Lambert had no intent on winning that game and I don’t think he sees our lack of creativity as a problem. He bought on Sanchez and Baker and Bent. Not one of those will create anything

  82. Mark,

    Yes, you have a valid point about the crowd and what it should mean to the owner. I recognise that but have just stated (in a different way) that it is an alarming situation.

    Though a new owner might trigger an uspsurge in interest, I suspect that otherwise it will be what the fans see on the pitch that will determine their attendance or no, Fox or no Fox.

  83. I have to say iv seen nothing in the first two games( early days I know), that points to us having an easier season or breaking into the top half.
    Lambert won’t change, he is a negative manager, much the same as his predecessor, only Lambert is in serious denial, he said we were excellent after sat bore, whilst iv seen us play a lot worse, we were far from excellent.
    Until we get taken over and he is ousted, we are going nowhere fast, unless there is a miracle before next Monday when the window slams shut, we can write off this season as nothing more than survival.

  84. JL

    as with the team the crowd situation is in its early days and time will tell with the teams performances being the governing factor, cheap tickets/promotions will become available etc. you will get more casual users as tickets for the better teams will be available when normally they aren’t. none of this is how we would like it but its where we are no more no less.

  85. one for you steamer: Lambert on Lerner 🙂

    Lambert said: “He always has loved the football club. “The situation is that the club is for sale and that is the same, but he has been great since the players came back for pre-season. “He has always been great with me, and since we came back, the feel-good factor has been due a lot to him, for what he is doing. “The football club, for all that doom and gloom that was out there before a ball was kicked, is in a really good place at the moment.”

  86. Lambert must generally love Randy. He’s the luckiest manager in football in the fact that our owner doesn’t give a feck, and hasn’t since Lambert took charge of us. If Randy did care, Lambert would have been sacked about 20 times over as Villa manager. The alarm bells would have been ringing when Chelsea beast us 8-0, but should have been about 15. The final straw should have been after Wigan slaughtered us 3-0 a few days after Spurs battered us 4-0, but nope. Then Came Bradford and Millwall, still stayed in a job

    Second season. How is he still in a job after the final whistle against Spurs ? 20 defeats in a season, 12 home defeats. Doubled over by Stoke, Fulham and Palace. Played the most amount of long balls. Lost 8 of our last 10 prem games, but yet he’s still the manager of this club

    B62 as usual is spot on. We have 4 points of the board which is good( needs to be 7 after Hull) but the style i. Which we are playing is no different. If anything, more defensive which is why we have kept 2 clean sheets. There are positives, Hutton, the back four in general but passing it, creating, scoring,it’s still as useless at it was last season. We need those new owners in quick

  87. Mark’s link to the barcodes report…

    I was a bit amused by this…

    “when Williamson was sent off for a second yellow card … the match petered out after that.”

    Huh? We were already in added time by that point! 🙂

    Anyhow, great to read that he considered Brian Little to be “a real gent”.

  88. JL

    draw 😉

    just looked at the stats for the newcastle game last year which we lost 1-2
    they had 17 shots 8 on target we had ten 1 on target and we had 55% possession

    this time they had 11 with 4 on target we had ten with 0 on target 40% possession

  89. Mark,
    I think it’s been established 100% that Lambert is a compulsive liar “Randy loves the club” that’s why he’s watched us once in 18 months. Do you actually believe ANYTHING that he says ?

  90. Mark: draw 😉

    I don’t know whether it is or not – I’ve not been keeping the score of this match! 😉

    I would say that your approach is to try to see only the +ves, but my view is that to do that you might walk into a door and hurt yourself! You’ve got be careful about the dangers of life as well, n’est ce pas?

  91. … Actually, Mark, your approach seems to see only the +ves in Villa (not a bad thing of course), while being willing to see the world having a right to be gun-toting!

    I suppose the Villa is a form of escapism?

  92. steamer
    nope 🙂

    JL

    I don’t think I’m too positive I’m very practical, of course things are not tickety boo at villa park I have never claimed it is. in my eyes the vast majority see mostly the negatives is that a better position? I can see both and agree with plenty of the so called negative posts. I just find it frustrating that most choose to downgrade any positives because they don’t count because its villa? not very balanced at all, those positives exist along with the negatives yet the overall theme seems to be negative and therefore not really accurate.

    as for portraying me as a pro gun lobbyist? bit below the belt. I was merely pointing out the erosion of choice and Liberty they perceive, yes of course the mentality existing in the states can be termed gung ho, the world will only be better without guns if the mindset changes. As I pointed out most males in Switzerland own military rifles by requirement for defence but that country doesn’t have a gun problem.

    the villa is a passion we all share is it not? and according to most is not much of an escape. As entertainment it is escapism but one people attach far to much of their personal identity to IMO

  93. Mark in my eyes the vast majority see mostly the negatives is that a better position?

    Of course not, but my views are always middle-of-the-road and it’s in that context I was speaking. You appear to suggest that I’ve been writing negatively, but I was merely highlighting some quite serious issues that we hope can be resolved.

    I’m afraid you’ve misread that bit about gun-toting … I was trying to establish what appeared to be an inconsistency in viewpoints, that’s all.

    Yes, you’re right, it is too easy to become over-attached to a sport (or pop-star or other entertainment icon) and make it more important than it really is, and that’s quite a topic for conversation.

  94. A very good assessment of the match by the Toon fan, and well written.

    Just watched the first half of the match again, and about to watch the second half, and it is often more interesting, when you have watched the match at the ground. The amount of creativity was far higher than in matches last season, and when you see them again, it brings home the truth of players gelling together. A lot of opportunities in the final third came to nothing because a player did not look up, or hold the ball a little longer, or did not dispatch the pass sooner. or failed to see the unmarked player in space. the more we do this, and the more the players gaiun the confidence, I am sure we shall get better results. The most important is that the back four are so much more solid. The more Hutton Vlaar and Sendeross gain in their forward movement, will also bring improved results. it was also good to see Guzan passing the ball out far more than he usyally does.

  95. A very good assessment of the match by the Toon fan, and well written.

    Just watched the first half of the match again, and about to watch the second half, and it is often more interesting, when you have watched the match at the ground. The amount of creativity was far higher than in matches last season, and when you see them again, it brings home the truth of players gelling together. A lot of opportunities in the final third came to nothing because a player did not look up, or hold the ball a little longer, or did not dispatch the pass sooner. or failed to see the unmarked player in space. the more we do this, and the more the players gain the confidence, I am sure we shall get better results. The most important is that the back four are so much more solid. The more Hutton Vlaar and Sendeross gain in their forward movement, will also bring improved results. it was also good to see Guzan passing the ball out far more than he usually does.

  96. Paul: The most important is that the back four are so much more solid.

    Whilst agreeing that it’s a very important matter, I’m not sure whether it is the most important … I for one would much prefer to see the Villa wining 3-2 rather than 1-0 (or draw 2-2 rather than 0-0), and you need to score goals to win matches, I believe! 😉

    BTW, even on TV I saw some of the creativity you mention go to waste (mainly) because of lack of awareness on someone’s part … but the really worrying thing is that in Zoggy, Gabby and Andi we have players who’re not kids and have played together long enough. They should by now have the understanding between them to have more composure.

    And the upshot was zero shots on target, though Zoggy’s 2 efforts were pretty close.

    Ah, well, let’s see what happens over the next few weeks, especially with Benteke’s return, though I’m worried we might be placing too much reliance on his re-appearance as being the answer.

  97. JL

    if that was my viewpoint! I think you took my sense of humour as me stating my wish to arm the world 🙂
    I would like a bow though and a big sword 😉

    Paul
    we created a lot of potential just the right man being in the right place missing Gabby and weiman have never really had that knack, time for bent. the young lad Burke has it in buckets a bit of a sniffer clarke of leeds and england fame

  98. JL

    my experience of playing at the back was If we defended well and nicked a win against the run of play it didn’t lower my sense of achievement it was bloody hard work and well deserved. I understand people want to see goals I’d rather see them all in the oppositions end though 🙂 , great teams start with good defending, you have to be incredibly good to play that gungho in this league, would be nice to have the option but give me something solid to build from all day.

  99. Evening all…

    Taking a few days off, getting my daughter up to her first year of university and settled in.

    Found this comment from B62 interesting:

    “Our lack of creativity is worrying, and if not rectified will haunt us again this season, as a team we only scored something like 39 goals all season and conceded shitloads.”

    So, the approach is obviously to score more and conceded less. This football business is easy. 😉

    Lots of overlapping things there, but conceding less isn’t going to hurt us. I think we conceded third-most last year, 64 or some such.

    Pragmatist that I am, I’ll take the four points. I agree with all that Gabby and Weimann are lacking. I would think their inclusion has as much to do with industry and experience as anything else. Probably also trying to get them going if replacements can’t be brought in. I don’t really think Lambert is all that enamored of them, and I’ve often said they were better for playing alongside Benteke. Basically, you get as many of the pieces going as you can until your best side is available.

    Grealish will end up playing, I’m sure, and Charlie needs to be brought back slowly.

    Purely in terms of looking at the whole season and the points needed, I’d likely also focus on shoring up the shape and defensive understanding and grabbing what points we can, however we can, given the run of matches coming after Hull. That seems to imply taking the draw when it was on the cards.

    I know it doesn’t make for mouth-watering entertainment at times, but oftentimes, doing the smart thing is hardly the exciting thing. Lots of teams have gone down playing attractive football, and I think the model for Lambert is the way Chelsea and Mourinho approach things. Of course, they simply have much better players, but it’s a valid way of going about things.

  100. JC
    evening mate, I think he will bring in a couple to shake up the attack he has to really, and I’m sure more will leave to. after the sorry defending of the last two seasons I’m hoping the good start the defence has made only improves and the midfield with Sanchez functions as it should. I do agree we could be a poor mans chelsea, I was saying just the other day how mourinho used drogba in much the way we use tekkers. we desperately need that player to link play and create after many false dawns, on that front the signs are we will get someone this week.

  101. Wotcha Goebbels,

    Ever the pragmatist,aren`t we?Agree almost entirely.The Chelsea comparison is spot ,but as you say,employed with top draw players.He nails his tactics to mast.I mean he sells Mata,a lovely player,but an unreliable one in Jose`s eyes.Hard to get mr nut around that one,but I understand it.
    If ,as it would appear,the basis of creating a side begins with a tight,well drilled B4,then why hasn`t Lambert seen and constructed this from his 1st day in charge?Why only in year 3 of his tenure?Could it be that he trusted his judgement re Baker,Joe B.Luna, etc,etc.or did he trust A.N.Other`s judgement?What was Lerner`s input in relation to buying and trusting players clearly not up to the task?As ever with AVFC.more questions than answers.
    Whatever the reasons I can`t defend Lambert on this one really,2 seasons of trotting out with an inferior B4 and only now does he attempt to rectify it.Anyway,better late than never.
    Good to see you back John.

  102. b6
    I think for some reason be it wage restriction or initial cost he only brought in players under a certain age last year. the whole young and hungry was basically young and cheap, a huge gamble which wouldn’t cost us if they didn’t make it. when in reality we needed experience in the 26-30 range. for me the overall aim was wage reduction.

  103. Mark ,
    I have a recurve bow and I can highly recommend archery as stress relief . There is no such thing as a ‘crazed ‘ bow-wielding maniac. Archers are generally cool , calm , mofo’s!

  104. prox

    had a go in the summer good fun, my friend got a Mongol replica with a 100+ pound pull we could barely budge it and I’m not weak. would really like to have a go at the proper sword and shield martial arts too has always fascinated me .
    I watched a documentary about re-enactment medieval style. a bunch of polish lads are the champs you have 6 aside and anything goes bar stabbing they proper clout each other all in armour mind but once your down your out, absolute mental. think that might be a tad too far but you never know 🙂

  105. 100lb bow !! thats just acting the bollix.
    Seriously Mark , dont even attempt to draw it if your not an archer , you could do yourself serious harm. Olympic re-curves are usually 40-50 lb with a 70 mtr range target.
    The record i think is a 130lb ,7ft bow in Iceland , its a freak , there is no practical use for such a bow unless you’re trying to hit Norway with an arrow!
    In antiquity, naval archers usually had the biggest bows for obvious reasons (100lb anchored bows) and divers to a very well preserved 4/5th century wreck in the Agean were able to identify navaal archers by the curvature of their upper bones .

    Have you tried a compound bow yet , they are fun but extremely dangerous . They’re a recent enough invention but they just dont have the class of the traditional.

  106. prox

    weren’t longbows 120? but basically pull and release and used enmasse as artillery 12 arrows a minute! . you have to think the archers of old were monsters but if you practised every day for 20+ years with ever increasing bow strengths you’d get there. I believe in England they stopped the Sunday football and made them practice archery and some PT it was that important. the France used crossbows as it took so long to train a longbowman. hence the two finger sign as the french cut the two fingers off to make them useless but you probably know all this, how long have you been doing it? I have tried a modern bow found it fairly easy once I worked my body position and the drop out

  107. Being linked to another striker who can’t score

    Neville saying teams at the very least need players with the legs, energy, power etc to stand a chance of staying up

    Thankfully with Huuton, Okore, Vlaar, Sissy, Sanchez, Delph and Benteke we have power and pace. Just need the quality now . Have a week left to sort it out

  108. No mark , all of them were not 120lb , you made your own bow to suit yourself so I seriously doubt that the vast majority of archers got above 100lbs . But its like you say , they were used as artillery , crossbows were much more accurate and easy to use at close quarters , defending from ramparts etc.
    I’ve been doing target archery for 4-5 years now but not at a competitive level. I’ve my own range and I like to spend 60-90 mins at a time just trying to perfect repititon. Its a great way to empty the mind of all the shit we fill it with.
    Archers/fletchers were well paid peasant ‘tradesmen ‘ at one time in England.

  109. Mark ,
    Never really fished except when the local fish farm was breached during stormy weather and local streams got invaded by hundreds of rainbow trout .You could catch 15-20 fish in two hours with a bleedin tesco bag!! My boys want to try fishing but if they dont catch a couple of hundred in the first 5 minutes , the rod will disappear and minecraft will appear on some device or other.
    I’m lucky with the garden , i live in the sticks and my house and garden is on 1 acre of land with very little garden to the front so i’ve got a good spread at the back . It has its advantages and disadvantages .
    Might give the fishing a shot sometime , is it worthwhile buying a cheap starting rod from lidl /aldi for starters?

  110. Again mate , exceptions are being used to exagerate the norm. You’ve pulled a 100lb bow, you know how difficult it is and you are probably a bigger man than most of the mongols were . There is no way the average man can fire even a 100lb bow accurately from almost any distance in terms of target shooting and especially not from a galloping fucking horse! A 50-60lb bow at best with ground archers maybe hitting the ton and over . The mongols were excellent horseback archers but high poundage bows are simply for artillery. I’m nowhere even approaching expert on the subject but i just dont buy the claims in that article .

  111. prox

    on the fishing you will probably get a half decent float rod and reel and a few bits for £50 at a tackle shop and they will help you. most modern stuff will be fine but like all things decent kit is nice to have but costs a bit more. lucky man would like an acre myself to grow some grub. as you say 160 on horseback you’d have to have some core strength to stop you falling off and inner thighs like a vice 🙂

  112. Lambert said after Newcastle that we will see what happens in the next ” couple of weeks” regards to transfers

    Erm, the twat does know that there’s only 1 week left right ?

  113. Cheers, B6.

    I think Mark’s right about Sanchez…You take almost any back four, leave them on their own, and they’ll eventually get sliced and diced.

    When it comes to the back four, I think we’re seeing the almost inevitable downside of “young and hungry”. You go out, you buy some players with potential on the cheap, and the odds are, just like with the academy, that most won’t make it.

    It isn’t a big deal in terms of money, and they’re easy enough to move on. But, if you don’t find a couple winners, it seems like a waste of time. Yet, you have to sort through the chaff. That’s the nature of the approach.

    I haven’t really gone down the transfer fees in order, but it seems like when Lambert has actually spent some money, the players have been decent, like Vlaar. No one really seemed to know who he was, he was slated by a lot of fans, and there he is anchoring the Dutch back three and acquitting himself well against many of the best attacking players in the world. He’s a good player.

    But we know Lambert’s been working on a ridiculously tight budget…so, even a £5m player has been a big signing. Luna, Bennett, Lowton, Bacuna…peanuts, really. Baker and Clark, already signed on.

    I think I’d trust him with more money. If there’s a new owner, who knows what happens with him. But I don’t think he’s quite the fool many make him out to be. You just can’t spend all your life around football, having played at a decent level, and have no idea. Success often has as much to do with circumstance and timing as anything.

  114. This is my first post on this site. Not sure what all the fuss is about following a couple of drab performances. After 2 seasons of abject mediocrity under PL I need to see more than what we’ve witness thus far to believe we have turned the corner.

  115. dipesh

    OK slot in a couple of heavy defeats say 3-0 to stoke and 3-1 to united and see if your perspective changes any? to me it looks like progress as we are fielding a different group of players and getting results where we didn’t last season. nobodies saying we have turned any corners it just looks like a more solid base to work from.time will tell
    JC
    I think you may be right, kosak, vlaar,benteke all above that 1.5m fee range westwood, lowton, bacuna the other minor successes the rest already here. okore 4m yet to tested

  116. Dear all,

    Today we move house 1 mile across town (!) but it means I will be disconnected from the Internet for more than 7 days! 🙂

    So, I’ll be back on about the 4th or 5th … perhaps by then we’ll have beaten Hull 7-0 and everyone’s in bliss!

  117. Thanks MK! Indeed the defence is looking much better but should it have taken PL’s 3rd season to shore up the glaringly obvious deficiencies? he has brought in a number of full-backs in his time with little effect on the overall defending until this season. Aside from that, the football remains awful from where I’m sitting.

    Similarly not sure if PL deserves any credit for the minimal progress as surely this is the least a fan is entitled to expect from a coach after full two seasons?

  118. dipesh

    personally I don’t mind who is credited as long as we see improvement. I don’t think there is a snowballs chance in hell the new owner will keep Lambert on anyway. I think he tried to utilise baker and Clarke to stretch the budget and got unlucky with Okore. the left backs are a mystery and the right backs not much better but bargain bucket is bargain bucket and there’s no guarantees, in fact if you watched Johnson defending for Liverpool you can pay a fortune and still have a dud.
    not addressing or unable to? in retrospect if he hadn’t hamstrung himself with young and hungry and called it cheap and cheerful, and got some experience in too, it could have been different. how much we will never know as I suspect he’ll be gone soon.

    JL
    good luck mate

  119. one thing I will say is even bertrand who started off solid ended up nowhere near as good after a few games alongside clarke and baker. with the defence the whole is greater than the individual. a good organiser which it appears sendeross is can make a massive difference. I have been there myself, constant encouragement and cajoling is required or they just switch off. defence is the one position especially centre back that positional sense and game reading is essential, they just didn’t have it, in fact apart from vlaar and maybe tekkers nobody did. ok maybe westwood but things were so disjointed it would have taken a miracle to do your own job and organise, maybe Sanchez is that man. cissy has raw power etc but switched off a couple of times against Newcastle, something we can ill afford against better teams so we are by no means sorted. even huttons a bit last ditch too often.

  120. It seems like Lambert is hanging on by his finger nails he got a 0-0 draw at home with no shots on target with a very poor possession percentage in front of a home crowd of just 28,000, he had a chance to try and win the game by bringing on some offensive players earlier and give the Newcastle defence something to think about, but with subs like Baker and Sanchez it tells you one thing and one thing only he was content with a point.

    The defence looks more solid than last year but we will need to see them up against one of the top six sides to be able to make a defining judgement, the midfield still lacks creativity and has done since Lambert has been in charge, could Grealish be the answer I am not sure wether we will get the chance to find out.

    The strikers are looking a shambles work rate is good but we need players who can at least warm the opposing keepers hands, I fear we are holding too much hope on Benteke coming back to again get us out of the mire, and lets be fair if he does start scoring goals what chance him being a Villa player come January.

    The improvement is miniscule in Lamberts third season but the football is still awful to watch, the Villa fans have and will always vote with their feet when the football on view is no better than what you can get from lower divisions, Lambert is a dead man walking and will definitely be replaced if new owners come on board very soon.

    UTV

  121. swv
    when Sanchez came on we were under the cosh, he steadied it. then Richardson came off for bent, you would of assumed to take it to them. so Richardson wasn’t on the pitch when cissy got injured whom he would surely of replaced leaving room for grealish.
    grealish was getting warmed up when cissy got injured, Richardson had been sacrificed for bent so baker came on to secure a point.
    personally I would like to have seen grealish, nzogbia and bent from the off but can understand that Newcastle aren’t pushovers so I can understand not wanting to lose considering Septembers shit fest.
    despite our being useless in front goal we played ok in the first half and sat back after Newcastle changed to 442, which leads back to top of my post

  122. SWV
    thats him and bennet there then? I hope he gets game time its what he needs after injury with less pressure but a decent level, with KEA rumoured to be going it should mean a player or two due in

  123. Mark,

    I still think that being at home we need to take the game on, but Lambert cannot see further than a point, with a net spend of £6.45m lets just see if we can get that creative player we so desperately need, not many teams spent less than us and we have shipped out quite a few players to further cut the wage bill, Lerner is definitely setting the club up for a quick sale.

    UTV

  124. swv
    I agree mate but the timing (sanchez first game, 6 top sides coming up) says a draw was a minimum. I thought Sanchez freed up delph significantly. a benito carbone type and the argie lad we were linked with would change the way we play totally so here’s hoping. wasn’t our initial pot rumoured to be £10mil and lerner has released another 10 since?

    did anyone else think brian dean was totally one sided for three quarters of the match?

  125. Mark- Dean was shocking. Booked Zoggy for his first tackle. Booked Sanchez when he didn’t even foul anyone. He gave Newcastle a lot

    Generally gutted Gardner has gone. Was looking forward to seeing him play tomorrow but I’ll probably be blessed with Kea and Gabby instead.

  126. frem
    one tackle on mutton after he had intercepted a through ball and ran across his area was a shocker could of been red and we didn’t even get a free kick. meanwhile Newcastle had several incidents the same as ours with no card

  127. Gards exit is a strange one, surely we need some cover in midfield, KEA looks like he is off to feyenoord( thank god), yet another lambert signing obviously out of his depth in the premier league, let’s be honest he was shite, the best comment iv read about him was ” Iv seen the Wind change a football match, more effectively than him”
    A takeover looks a distant dream, and it seems we are stuck with dumb and dumber for yet another season( surely this will be the last).
    Lambert isn’t going to change his style come year 3, so it will be more chaos and bizarre selections/formations/tactics/signings , he is stupid saying we were excellent against Auf Weidersain pet star 11, we clearly weren’t and the stats prove it, no shots on target is a joke, we had the attacking threat of a curled up hedgehog. He even said “we hope to do some more business over the next couple of weeks” when asked about transfer targets, this despite the window shutting 1 week after his comment.
    I can’t see being up to much again this year and will again finish in the bottom 6, and in yet another survival battle, unless there are new owners in hiding who will buy us the players we need to make steady progress is challenge for top 10, then sort it out properly in the summer next year( can’t believe I’m already looking to next summer to sort the club)

  128. first two subs could agree with get sanchez on with 2 alongside him to get up too speed,but to put baker on man is hopeless not even league one standard delph could have went to left back then either cole grealish or bacuna any one but baker,he has gone backwards like all the rest of great academy kids,it is time to forget about academy when was last player that came through barry came from brighton did i read yesterday gabby has 6 goals in39 home matches for lambert

  129. I expect an exceptionally low turn out against Orient, only 10-15k plus what orient bring.
    I’m not going I’m at ante natal for 3 hrs, and as bad as that is, it gives me an excuse not to go to VP to get wet and pissed off

  130. b62
    have you been watching ground hog day again? gardener needs game time simple as and he’s not first choice, I don’t think its a bad move they try to play football, should suit him, never hurt grealish.

    james
    maybe, but Delph was our only real creative threat once cissy went off. baker has hit a ceiling, physical attributes can only get you so far, am more surprised by clarkes decline

  131. B62
    good luck with the baby hope all goes well mate.

    Dutch club Feyenoord are expecting to sign Aston Villa playmaker Karim El Ahmadi to a long-term contract this week.

    Championship side Brighton have completed the capture of Villa midfielder Gary Gardner on loan until January.

    has to be players due in this leaves us with delph westwood and sanchez

    senderos and hutton have made several teams of the week including the bbc

  132. Mark King..

    I think there was no initial 10M.. but once a sale didn’t look imminent Lerner made 10M available..

    I don’t think there is 10M plus the other 3M left over.. hope i am wrong but i doubt it very much..

    Would be fantastic to get in a AM and Winger.. won’t hold my breathe thou..

  133. In the last two summer windows we have brought our most expensive recruit in the last few days.. is that me clutching at straws for this window too 😀

  134. lionheart

    I can’t see him risking players on loan and selling KEA if there isn’t someone inbound. cole isn’t reliable enough fitness wise johnsons on loan too.
    If someone comes in it has to be a starter in midfield + a winger/forward
    you may be right lets hope he can seal it this time instead of hearing who we nearly had 😉

  135. KEA being sold and Gardner going on loan , confirms the information given to everyone before that there is to several moves away from VP and several players coming in on the last day. Keane and Lambert do not want deals being snatched from under their noses at the last minute.

    Tomorrow will be a near a first team , with Cole starting and Grealish replacing him later and maybe a couple of others. Bent will also start, I am sure.

    Lambert and Keane know they need good cup runs this season, and to consolidate in the league.

  136. Paul- a Surely Grealish will start tomorrow and not the shite Gabby and Wiemann ? Give Bent a go. Give my gran a go, anyone but those two

  137. Mark- did that article say KEA is a playmaker ? Ha

    James- any have decent manager, weather it be under 10 in a Sunday league would have put Delph left back and bought Grealish on for Sissy. We don’t have a half decent manager though who was delighted with a dire 0-0 at home without having a single shot on target. He’s worse than Mcliesh

    Hope KEA does go. But with Gardner going as well, and our no creativity in our side, then we need a CM and winger in.

    So what’s the odds on Lambert not doing that and buying a left back instead ?

  138. Might well do SWV. Won’t solve our creative problems one bit though

    Still holding on hope that Gabby will be sold before the window shuts. 1 year left on his contract. Got to be a conference side that needs a squad player hasn’t there ?

  139. Morning SWV

    Allegedly Palacios has two legs,but we await confirmation.

    Not a good player,very tall,physical player,can not pass water,terrible distribution.He might fit in quite well.Ha,Ha/

  140. He won’t look out of place one bit then 😉

    Remember him at Wigan, he was a beast. Very good player then

    Since his brother died his career has gone down hill. Shame really

  141. b6

    perhaps they are taking victor Frankenstein on as physio in an attempt to resurrect some of our players maybe even Palacios brother ? might even fit an extra leg for £20 oh yeah by the way………..

  142. I think im the only villan not expecting any good attacking, passing football.

    We are shit, with no money to buy decent players who can do this. We are in a relegation battle, and you dont play pretty football fighting for your lives.

    Granted when we get a new owner and manager ill be expecting some decent footy but until then…..

    4points on the board another 35? To go…..fight fight fight

  143. Hope Carruthers shows Lambert his quality tonight. Has more ability in his little toe than Gabby does

    Andrew- your not the only one. Just watch our last two games and you will realise possession attacking football is not on the agenda for Lambert

    Must be close to breaking the record for most games with out having a single shot on target in games. If we are lucky we get one. Seemed to happen a lot last season

  144. Oh dear United. There showing Lambert why you should never, ever play 5 at the back. It’s a terrible formation that Lambert kept playing and playing and playing. Of course we kept losing and losing and losing

  145. Frem,
    I thought we usually played 4 at the back last year?
    I remember us playing 5 at the back when we beat Man City, but not many other times.

  146. His first season mainly Robbo. Played against Chelsea, Spurs and Wigan all in a week and we lost 15 nill. Played a few other times as well.

    Remember we played it against hull away last season and west ham and they were two shocking games.

    Hopefully he will stick with 4 at the back this season. Pretty sure he will attempt 5 though . Normally does

  147. We better not be outdone by MK Dons in the cup.
    Morale must be really low at Man U at the mo. Be interesting to see how United’s fans and manager react over the next few days to their humbling at the hands (or feet) of the mighty Dons.

  148. Stat of the Week: Ashley Westwood finished the game with a pass completion rate of 93%. Only Arteta averaged more than this last season from midfield.

  149. Mark,
    He only touched the ball twice though. Although i didn’t see the game last night a dog walker told me that Carruthers wrecked untied, the lad has 100 times the talent of Westwood and when he played he did really well, just another Lambert balls up that will cost the club.
    Lets get another two or three left backs in then in January we can concentrate on signing some more injured players.

    Welcome Dipesh, totally agree with you as with Andrew.

  150. Think the dummy will rest either Weimann or Flabby and give Bent a go. Fancy a very tight game with Bent scoring the winner and be left out for the Hull game as a reward.

  151. Both Curruthers and Grealish must be ready to be given a go. The attack is lacklustre and needs some youthful drive and talent. There’s some experience at the back and in the middle now to help them along the way. We’ve apparently got a good holding midfielder now in Sanchez. We’ve got Senderos and Vlaar at the back. And Hutton’s gained valuable lessons on his European odyssey. The cups are the times to play these guys. They can’t be kids forever. I know Grealish is still only 18, but he’s got some decent professional games behind him now. If Gabby and Weimann don’t perform, bench them, use them as reserve strikers along with DB. Kozak and Tekkers can’t play 100% when they return.

  152. trinity
    carruthers has been sold to mk dons

    steamer

    I knew you’d bite 😉
    rumour is it will be a strong team and it sounds like cole will play. lambert see’s him as a central player not a winger. okore should get a shout but please god not with clarke or baker. would be nice for grealish and bent to start rest nzogbia fot sat. hope he plays Sanchez but who plays with him is anyones business if cole starts

  153. Jay Spearing!!! FFS is there no end to our humiliation??
    Spearing is absolutely dogshit, he is worse than what we are getting shot of, I’d rather play Roy Keane 😉
    If this is the calibre of our transfer targets in the next few days, we are well and truly fucked, and goes to show Lambert has learned nothing, and Lerners only aim is for 17th, until he can offload the club which looks a long way off.
    I predict a close game tonight, maybe pens in front of a very empty stadium.

  154. Mark
    Thanks for the article. Obviously, I didn’t keep up with all the news while in Aus.

    I’m surprised Curruthers wasn’t given more time at Villa, thought he had a big future if given the chance. Guess he went to MK Dons to get more playing time.

  155. Trinity
    Tough one as haven’t seen him play much latley, he is a bit of a maverick, bit lippy and crossed swords with lambert by flouting club rules.. I liked him from his u21 days but obviously keane/lambert don’t or he may of asked to go when the offer came in. On the other hand he could be another bannan

  156. Not even Lambert would scoop that low and get Spearing

    See he’s been talking up Joe Cole. Said hes the perfect type of player to bring on in games to find that killer pass

    Hang on a minute Paul. I think we just had one of those situations, and you put on a useless defender and a defensive mid instead.

    Only a few days left to save our asses. Without any creativity, most our matches will be like Saturday was with no shots on target

  157. frem
    there was no way in hell Sanchez wasn’t going to come on on Saturday, we were under the cosh, he steadied the ship and drove us forward enabling delph to push on. bent was brought on in the hope of getting on the end of cissys crosses, cissy got injured and his replacement at left back should of been Richardson. nzogbia went off before he got himself sent off and Richardson was knackered. so grealish/cole who they showed sitting back down had been warming up. I don’t think it was a conspiracy to draw. changes should of happened earlier IMO but if they had we could of been left with ten men assuming cissy still got that injury

  158. Guzan, Steer, Bennett, Bowery, Dawkins, Holt, Luna, Bertrand, Lowton, Westwood, Bacuna, Tonev, Kozak, Benteke, Senderos, Okores, Cole, Cissokho, Sanchez, Helenius, Richardson, KEA, Vlaar
    They are the players who Lambert has brought to club( inc loans, unless iv missed some out), it just shows how poor his judgement 9 of those are not here and KEA is expected to leave for Feyenoord before the deadline, and Lowton is def on the way out, he left stoke on his own not on the team bus.
    That list shows the disjointed scatter gun approach and sheer waste of wages, there is a distinct lack of quality on show there, this is demonstrated by the fact he has tried to offload so many of his signings, and is now utalising the very players he ostracised .
    Whilst he is the manager we will not improve, whilst Lerner is the owner we will not improve, despite all the PR bullshit we are in the same mess as last season, the season before and the same as under Mcleish.

  159. b62

    so whats new? I don’t think Lamberts the greatest mate but most of last seasons signings were gambles, low price low wage, bar 2 and they are still here kosaka and bakuna who are back ups. he’s governed by what he can spend and I’m guessing that last season they wanted at least resale value, all those players were never going to make it. Show me a manager who has a 100% hit rate, most I’d guess are 50/50 and moved on within two years.

    have a look at mons, I think I’m right that only 2 remain from Mon’s signings and he was handing out 5 year contracts to most like mcleish did. its been a right fuck up from the off but at least Lambert is trying to change it. an entire squad on lower wages isn’t easy to achieve whilst staying in the prem look at united. on his remit I don’t know what you expect

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1301712/Buy-buy-Martin-How-ONeill-spent-120million-years-Aston-Villa.html

  160. Still no need to have put baker on though Mark. Delph could have slotted there just fine and we could have tried to win the game with Grealish or Cole coming on instead. Our manager isn’t a winner though. Hes worse than Mcliesh. When you saw Baker stripped of, all hope of winning went out the window

    B62- I hope we don’t lose Lowton. Hutton needs some competition at right back, could probably cover left back to. I expect him to start to tonight

    That list of players is frightening.

  161. frem

    he could of but I think we would of lost to much from the middle in a tight game and delphs runs from the back without protection from the midfield that he provides Cissy would probably caused to many probs

  162. Mark,

    Are you the only one that cannot see that Lambert is clueless, the majority of his signings have been crap, his team selection is crap, his tactics are crap, and to top it all he is gutless, he blames Faulkner and Lerner for the bomb squad saying he was told not to play them because of their high wages, well if he had any balls he would have told Lerner to stuff his job and left VP with some integrity, oh and by the way these players were still being paid for doing fuck all.

    UTV

  163. Mark
    My point isn’t just how many players he’s bought only to loan out/sell or let leave. It’s how disjointed the squad is under him and the glaringly obvious lack of quality.
    Yes he had wage constraints, however 10 or so players on between 10-25k per week, plus the bomb squad wages that we were still paying, it shows how short sighted he has been, and not financially as savvy as we are led to believe.
    Surely utilising the bomb squad and adding 3/4/5 players of a higher quality on better wages would have been the route to take, rather than scatter gun hit and hope.
    Yes O’Neill wasted money, but the difference was we had full houses, cup runs, Wembley and top 6 finishes consistently , which could have been even better.
    Lambert has kept us continually in the relegation mire, despite bringing 23 or so players through the door!!
    Please don’t say we needed numbers as we could have used what we had better, many of those 23 have hardly played and have been a complete waste of funds/wages.
    If he knew what he was doing we would have been reaping the rewards by his third season, for me we are no further forward, if Vlaar goes aswell , we are back to being fragile at the back, not a great combination when you only score 39 goals per season as a team!!!
    Lerner has been a disgrace followed closely by mcliesh and lambert, who both have bordered on disasterous

  164. Oh and while I am on a ranting mission some of the fans at VP are fucking clueless, did I see a banner of Collymore being held aloft on Saturday, what the fuck was that all about if you are looking for heroes try Little or even With but Collymore for christs sake.

    UTV

  165. Just looked up Spearing when he moved to Bolton…..very average midfielder, but got plenty of aggression and nastiness, and now Bolton captain……must be an RK recommendation then…

    Still not fully decided on going tonight, but can’t make the Hull game due to work, so may go to this one instead.

    Lambert seemed less than confident on his interview just now on Sky. Perhaps seeing the United result has brought back memories of Bradford..!!

  166. I’d hope to see Sanches Cole Grealish Bent and Bacuna all start tonight. We all know Wiemann and Gabby will though.

    Guzan
    Lowton
    Clark
    Baker
    Stevens

    Sanchez
    Gardner ( oh wait, he’s gone)

    Bacuna
    Cole
    Grealish

    Bent

    Hope we add a bit more quality before the window shuts because we are Desperate

    If KEA STARTS, that will be gutting. Hopefully pissing of back to Holland

  167. Paul
    Spearing is a very average championship player, so right up Lamberts street 😉
    At least we won’t be the biggest cup upset tonight, if the worst happened, which I don’t think it will.
    I think we will win, it won’t be a classic and not many will turn up despite Lambert and all his hype around playing a strong side and the debut of Old Joe Cole

  168. b62 & SWV
    name me one occasion where I have said lamberts the answer to all our dreams? you are singing to the choir. if you think I enjoy the whole crapfest we are in or wouldn’t swap him for rodgers or martinez you don’t know me at all.
    what I cant understand is why you bother to slate him it doesn’t change a thing especially as we are being sold and he’s a sitting duck. have you ever stopped to think who else we could of got with learner and the budget in place? we are bargain bucket here.
    Its funny how last seasons injuries had no effect in our league position but losing one top player in Vlaar would mean we are going down two games in. last season we lost 4 at least to bad injury and vlaar for 11

    look at the list of players Mon didn’t use at the time the moaning was massive, even when we did ok. I didn’t rate mon and given the same budget and constraints as Lambert I don’t think he would of faired much better, he’s not exactly known for being frugal. we will never know what Lambert might of achieved without constraints and we never will.

    Our great club was as close as its ever been to folding and still you think it should be better? i’m amazed we are still here! severe action was taken and we are just coming out the other side. the whole Lerner tenure has been mismanaged but it doesn’t change where we are.
    Also you may not have noticed but the price of a decent prem player and i’m saying only decent is £20+mil these days man utd have paid £60mil for a winger!!!! I would put our average at 2.5mil. out of the few we have bought that are useful we will make money, on some a lot. A lot of mons were losses except young ,downing and milner and I will never forgive him for selling Cahill.
    Certainly you may be right and we could of used what we had and been better for it, Mcleish tried that, how was that for you? the point I am making is you can’t trust Lerner to appoint a decent manager. Martinez was asked and side stepped the job so the writing was on the wall then.
    As for who is responsible for which cock up I don’t think any of us know the truth. Lamberts character? lets think mon pisses off at the drop of a hat and leaves us right in it, houlier kisses the liverpool badge, mcleish slates his own team and says it wasn’t me and O’Leary calls us fickle. Also if you think other managers don’t tell porkies to protect themselves or their team see wenger,fergie, mourinho……….. have I missed anything?

  169. oh and if there is anyone out there who has never choked back something he really wanted to say to his boss and towed the party line because he needs the work/money I’d be amazed. we even do it with our other halfs

  170. Mark,

    So that’s ok then is it when Faulkner tells him what players to pick and then he has to sit in front of the countries press and tell them his young team just got smacked by Chelsea 8-0, I call that gutless I would rather tell the truth and take my chances out there with a real football club trying to be run properly.

    UTV

  171. Mark i think the term is that ”You can’t polish a turd”

    This is why Lambert gets slated – he is in a very public position were people can and will form and voice opinion

  172. SWV
    oh mate, like all managers he would of been given a list of players that were in the price bracket and in this case the age range. Ginge couldn’t pick his nose and maybe Lambert had belief in what he was doing right or wrong. he’s also in the entertainment business and not a paedophile, hang on that’s a bit contradictory.
    well the next time your on £25,000 a week I’ll remind you of your moral obligations to give it all back and walk,
    talking of which where’s that £20?

  173. My turn,

    Mark,
    Strong team ? haven’t put one of those out since MON’s time.
    Bradford City’s team that whipped Lambert’s mob cost £7,500.
    Of course managers lie ( Except ballbag face ) but not every time they open their gobs, and such blatant ones too, he thinks we’re all stupid and not just the HC’s, oops, sorry. I very much doubt if there’s an honest soul at VP.

  174. steamer

    we both know the score mate just look at it and chuckle, take it to serious and they’ll be lining up a box for you.
    I shouldn’t think honesty is exactly rife in the prem as its only a reflection of a greedy society. the dons squad team 3.5m man utds ? league cup 1980-81 cambridge 2 villa 1

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