Against Sunderland, Aston Villa have had a pretty good time in recent years. Three seasons back, we thumped them 6-1 at Villa Park, a night where the atmosphere was as electric as it was hostile to then manager Paolo di Canio, with Villa a potent and unstoppable force. Last season, we managed to put four past them at the Stadium of Light.
Those performances, set against recent years of struggle, felt exciting. Yes, this is arguably because Sunderland have also struggled over the same period, but it felt good to have a glimpse of what it felt like to win, and win well.
This season, Villa are in too much of a nascent stage to be judged. The potential is more certainly there, but potential does not always deliver the guarantees of success. A win against Bournemouth is tempered again a pair of loss – one a harsh loss in the final minutes away at Crystal Palace, and the other the routine lets-roll-over-and-give-Manchester-United-some-points-at-Villa-Park that happens every season.
Set against those results, the odds seem favourable of Villa managing a win this afternoon. That said, Villa always seem to be uneasy when expectations are placed upon them, much preferring a lower level of pressure, as though this is a team that is stagestruck, unable to even have the belief in themselves to make it happen.
Under Tim Sherwood, Villa are certainly driven by a manager who is keen to show what he is capable of, a swaggering manager with a taste for flair and attacking – something of a stark contrast to many of Villa’s defensively driven teams.
Acquisitions are solid, although this is balanced against a season where the Premier League has invested heavily as a result of additional riches. The likes of Jordan Amavi and Adama Traore, for example, are solid examples of youthful talent who could be considered relative coups to acquire given Villa’s recent history.
Assuming that this season will be better just because a better class of player has been acquired, however, is a little presumptuous. Sunderland have managed to buy Yann M’Vila – a player who was previously courted by Arsenal – and others have strengthened. Leicester City getting Gokhan Inler in is still a feat, despite his recent years not being as solid as his peak. Similarly, Stoke City – now more tika-taka than tackle-heavy – have brought in Xherdan Shaqiri, a player who seemed destined for greatness a short while ago, having already played for Bayern Munich and Inter Milan.
However, all of this takes the focus away from the game in hand. Sunderland are potentially there for the taking having only manage one point so far. That said, when was the last time Villa went into a game expecting to win, and how easy was it to come away with the points.
We’ll find out soon enough.
The Author
Matt Turvey
Matt is the owner of, and chief writer for, Aston Villa Life. He is also a columnist for the Wolverhampton Express & Star, appearing in the Kick Off pullout on Saturdays and the Final Whistle pullout the Monday after Aston Villa play, as well as every Thursday as a blogger on their website. He has previously been featured as a writer on Football365 and Life's A Pitch, and was a regular pundit for Sports Tonight TV on Sky.Comments 112
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I’m just sat out on no balcony in Spain at the moment looking out to the sea 🙂 Not to bad. Only down side is ill will me missing Villa today. It’s only my second home game I’ve missed in 9 seasons though
It’s already a big game today after our joke of a display against palace. The first and second goals were laughable. I’ve said before, Guzan isn’t a good goalkeeper and Bacuna isn’t a good right back, or winger so I don’t know why he’s signed a long term deal
Hoping Adama is fit. What a payer, with gil and Grealish
Gabby better not start. I’m going for Rudy.
Hope we sign Lescott and Adybayor. Ady is an all round striker we need
morning matt
I don’t think recent seasons matter to this team they are that changed but I believe it will matter to Sunderland who have more or less the same team and memories of recent drubbings. They have been pretty poor if attacked with tempo and I think we will do just that, pressure Cattermole into an early yellow and the ball is rolling, Grealish alone should guarantee a rash tackle or 2 from their DM if Gil gets a run ditto.
Will Tim use Sinclairs hat-trick or Gils return to bench Gabby? personally I think it’s on the cards as Gestede already seemed to get the nod in Tims presser. Shame traore got injured and lets hope are wounded soldiers are over the shits or that could change the team drastically if the likes of Amavi, Richards ,Clarke, Gueye, Grealish or Sinclair have the shishkebabs.
villa win 3-0
Frem:
“It’s only my second home game I’ve missed in 9 seasons though.”
Kudos to you for being such a faithful supporter!
5under1and are there for the beating. We need to learn from Palace and Notts County games and stop the silly mistakes. Concentrate on defending. I still see a lack of on pitch organising, esp at the back.
Need some steady heads in midfield to retain possession.
We have enough options to make sure goals aren’t an issue.
Gabby has pace, that’s his main threat. Always has been. How many forwards in the same vein have Villa produced? Loads. You have to use it to your advantage, sometimes off the bench. Bit defenders don’t like pace, just look at Adama.
Today is a massive game in terms of taking points of a direct relegation rival, especially at home where we need to win all our battles with direct relegation rivals.
Traore looks like he will miss out today, which is a big loss, given how he has performed so far. We have done well against the Mackems in recent times and I hope that continues today.
Good leader and good following comments.
I think Mark made an interesting comment:
“I don’t think recent seasons matter to this team they are that changed but I believe it will matter to Sunderland who have more or less the same team and memories of recent drubbings”
Frem-Good on ya, mate!
Villa 2-0
interesting that on the AVFC site Adama is down as a striker in the Squad?
4-1 today, Grealish to get off the mark. Frem where in Spain are you?
hope lerner gets some stick today about 15m nett spend last 2 seasons big earners bent given delph benteke off wage bill where is our decent keeper goalscorer right back all this if we move some out can get one in ,we have only moved 19 players out and probabarly on richards in on big money,look at what wba,cpal stoke leicster watford newcastle have spent come on lerner give timsome money to improve team not squad
Poor team, poor squad, poor club. Evans to WBA and 33 yr old has-been Lescott to Villa…a perfect reminder of how far this club has fallen
A lot sick. Should still win.
I see the sun doesn’t shine over your house Paul. 🙂
Is gestede a championship player? We lose the creativity due to lines then Gil sits on the bench?!?!
Mutton doing well! Kozak?
Ok Ian? How r the bears?
Crackin goal! Gana amavi delicious! Get those crosses in and all the attacking player has to do is get a boot on it if he times his run well like Sinclair does!
Best way to stay in the line up—-Scott Sinclair.
I have always said that Sinclair is quality!
Bears and cougars are plentiful this year Ronnie. Hot dry summer produced a ton of early berries and the deer stayed down the mountain to drink at the lake as the streams dried up. The Cougars follow the deer so they are amongst the farms and houses closer to the lake. Bear poo everywhere.
I see Benteke has club feet today. Time for a 32 mill sulk
Ian- Paul’s never at his best on days with day in the name 🙂
shame no grealish and traore or Gil.
Gestede needs to lose the CB’s as they will just grab him, refs give naff all for wrestling in the box, drag them out and come back in. That said no height on the balls into the box to attack.
Mark,
No harm in trying Ayew at around 60 mins. Think Gestede needs better service but I guess the full backs would say they need better movement.
Clark sold himself.
Fascinating Ian! Hope ur well!
Not sold on Clarke this season! Their goal was shockingly easy! God that was so close to a goal from Richards unlucky! 3 points at VP, one can only dream!
Get Gil on for bacuna!
Rags they need to plonk it on the penalty spot thats there job not smash it in shoulder height.
Bacuna and wesrwoid for vertoute and gil
Sanchez is adapting to the premier league!
Would be a shame to leave two points in the table, mackems r there for the taking!
impressed by gana today! Looks quality! Gana Sanchez with a creator type is a solid midfield!
Time to put Kozak in
Wasted opportunity for all 3 points! Crying out for grealish!
Tims very conservative with his subs, Gil came on and found nobody to play off, to many not prepared to gamble. Gestede improved as the game went on but thought quite a few looked tired, maybe they all have the runs
Sh1t. Oh well. I take solace in liverpools loss.
Sicker than we know.
Soooo frustrating. Its going to be a long season. My early season optimisum has gone. Drained allready.
I actually think if we dont get our shit together we will go down. The most competitive league i can remember. Its certainly going to be tight.
I really thought our record at vp might get better under ts but its just the same….shit.
Still giving away soft goals….still……ah whats the point been saying the same thing over and over zzzzzzzz
Another worrying display and dire result
We need a striker in. I didn’t want Austin but we could need him now. We need Lescott as well
It’s early days but Sherwood needs to make subs better
Spend the cash I. The next few days or we will be in another dog fight
ronnie- I agree he is irreplaceable for us, makes things happen and him and Gil keep the ball for fun.
Nice to see Sinclair get another easy tap in 🙂 played well overall I thought
looking like sako was a miss too
C’mon fellers….
WE’RE ABOVE CHELSEA IN THE TABLE!! 🙂
agree frem a stiker in the class of austin – ade – michu is needed as we are power puff upfront
lescott will do for this season to improve the defence a little
gueye ia no attacking midfielder and i can understand what tim was trying to do get him to break forward but i think two of gueye westwood or sanchez would be good with gl 0or sinclair in that area
our defence mid are ok but they dont create
what i did like was the fact we are passing and showing more composure overall
just need the right additions tro become more effective
Andrew,
Amavi and Guzan (again!) and then Clark were at fault for their goals, and yet these players were good for the rest of the match.
So too Sanchez … I thought he was majestic first half and then a couple of frailties crept in his play at the start of the second … but recovered.
It was a good team performance today by and large … and without a couple of the best players as well.
We’ll get there…
we are humping to many balls towards gestade thou
just because you have a big lad upfront doesnt mean we should launch it towards him 25 times
Runtings,
I know you’re gilding the lilly, mate, but I only saw about 6 or 7 centres towards Rudi. 😉
Taking into account all the moves we made towards goal, 6 or 7 centres is OK i.m.o.
It amused me first have when the commentator remarked how O’Shea had “used all his experience” to head clear with Rudi present … but O’Shea had his hands round Rudi’s neck to keep him down! As in that instance vs Man U (against Richards). It must be something they get taught at Old Trafford!
s/b “first half” *not* “first have”.
Now, if Everton lose—not a bad day
You’re right John. Not a bad game. Lots of players missing. Next week should be fun
JL was just going to mention Chelsea are in a relegation scrap 🙂
considering we were without Grealish, Traore, Gil for 60 mins we were not awful just lacked guile. I think Tim told Gueye he wants him to attack, fully knowing he’s a better defensive mid. would be happy with him and Sanchez to play off. hard to fault Sinclair so would like to see 4 2 3 1 with a very interchangeable 4 up top. could even afford to play vertoute as a box to box mid instead of Gueye. Lots to come from this lot but Austin or the wolves lad would be excellent.
jl maybe a bit over the top on the launching to rudy but i think its closer to my figure than yours having watched the game
i am including launching hopefull crosses to him — i just think we should do that sort of thing a lot less than this new side is heading towards at the minute
players coming back should help that especially jack who i cant remember seeing hitting a ball in hope to many times
Don’t forget GAbby.
I do hope he can turn things around
runtingz- I agree, no good giving Gestede poor service, a grealish and Gil combo is the key to unlock a packed defence. especially as the manhandling by defenders just goes unpunished. Gestedes time will come and when we pull teams about he’ll get more space. If you watch his goals for Blackburn he made himself space and attacked the ball, no point in attacking him with the ball.
nice to see Liverpool still don’t know how to play benteke 🙂
Mark, Liverpool—hahaha
looks like cleverly has crocked himself shame.
i want to give sherwood time but first 4/5 games this season just don t know his tactics subs have a lot to be desired, we are still woefully short on class plus guzan is showing why he was dropped last season already,right back what can be said ,clark 2 clangers in a row another going backwards,westwood is a poor player and we cannot afford him and sanchez in one team sanchez is miles ahead of him,gil as my 10 boy said is scared dived when it only needed a touch to beat keeper
fox needs to get lerners cheque boo out we have only spent about 30m in last 5 years
James
The right back position is glaring and nothing done. Likewise about a striker.
Ian
“Next week should be fun” I have a good feeling about next week!!!
James- I think injury and the blindingly obvious will sort the team out. Ts has so many untried options he’s sticking to the players he knows. right know Sanchez should be the third name on the team sheet, behind richards and grealish, then gil, amavi gueye.
Triore when fit will be a permanent too the rest interchangable although I like the look of Vertoute
who can defend but is way better at going forward than any of our mids from what I’ve seen.
Well, I dunno, what’s the beef about the r-b slot?
I thought Hutton did pretty well today … and I’m not even one of his fans!
We should have won the game today.
Stupid error by Clarke – just stand up the forward – don’ t dive in
Sinclair did his job
Sanchez is getting better
Gana looks good
Gestede creates problems but his finishing is not great. We need a quality striker at the club.
Richards is solid.
And why didn’t we start with Gil. I love watching him on the ball.
Hopefully Grealish and Traore are back next week.
went today and Sherwood does not have a clue sorry but true what does westwood do? shanez is 100 times better in every way gusete is not good enough has kovac been at tims wife why is he not playing in front of this dross good points sinclair has to start every game down the middle why play at home with 3 stoppers in midfield bacuna and westwood hutton although better today and clark not good enough Sherwood is clueless need a proven goalscorer to go with sinclar give him untill christmas to wake up or be sacked plus points 22 shots without scabby the pub player may he remain crocked for ever missed the best player at the club by a mile in jack hope he soon gets fit as he is about 4 times better than any other player at the club
It must be hard for a lot of people to know who to blame today without Gabby playing. It’s hard for me to know who to blame with Sinclair playing well. Don’t fret we can slag off Gestede instead. UTV
There was no pressure on Hutton today, was it defoe on the wing? his crossing is woeful on the whole rarely beats the fullback and tends to stop the flow of play. Maybe with Triore in front of him he can stop at the half way line.
The problem Westwood has is there are better DM and better attacking options now, he has to reinvent himself or he will be pushed out eventually.
21 shots today 6 on target 62% pos should of won with those stats. sloppy defending again let us down or poor finishing depending on your viewpoint
Rags- no Gabby, loads of shots and 2 goals, coincidence or a crap Sunderland team? either way we didn’t really miss him and they parked the bus with little room in behind.
Only one team wanted to win it, last season we would have been the team playing for a draw. Counting the players missed through sickness and the fact we were the more composed team on the ball (baring the finishing), I think it’s progress. Did we deserve/need the 3 points? Yes. Still, a little early for the doom-mongering, maybe?
My sentiment too. villa lore.
How many of the players in the starting 11 and on the bench were ill too? These being the ones least knackered by the flu. Maybe Gil only had 25+ minutes in him. The others even less who knows.
As far as TS’s tactics go, I’m glad he is putting players in positions they aren’t that familiar with. They all should be able to play different positions if called upon. Not the goalies mind you.
1. Perhaps it was Concrete Ron’s play that made Clark look so good last year.
2. Another striker in — Austin would be my choice — and Gestede can come in off the bench.
3. New striker or no, Sinclair simply must play … 5 goals in 5 days!! No one else at the club knows how to finish better than him.
4. Lescott in or no, can’t wait for Okore to get well and then match fit. In a worryingly shoddy defensive side so far in the season, Clark has been the poorest defender of them all.
5. Gabby simply must stay on the bench — 7 goals in two games without his involvement, ’nuff said!!
Oh, and …
6. Really, really need a complete end-to-end right back. Bacuna and Hutton each have huge (though diametrically opposite) holes in their abilities.
Finally, no matter what, I’m still so very glad that we replaced our previous two managers with the mindset of someone like Sherwood. Even though the results haven’t been exactly what we’d been hoping for, our attacking intent is so much more clear and evident than it has been the last few years.
A bit dissappointed Villa didn’t win. That said Villa were the better team.
I was happy with most of the general play. The wins should come.
I thought Hutton played pretty well. Defoe couldn’t be bothered tracking back on him. For all the space Hutton got, it was usually wasted for various reasons.
I think Bacuna could have done better. He’ll be disappointed.
All-in-all, not a bad showing. Grealish will make a big difference this year,
It has to go down as two points lost, and highlighted the weaknesses in our team. We lack a goalscorer, Sinclair is showing up all our strikers, the bloke I go with pointed out we could have bought Austin and saved on wages, for the price of Gestede and Ayew, with Kozak as back up. We don’t look like being able to keep a clean sheet, Guzan is spreading fear to those in front of him he is looking a serious liability. We need a RB as Hutton doesn’t have the skill set to and Bacuna is a poor footballer wether he is playing in midfield or fullback, why he was given a new deal baffles me. Clark is always good for a mistake/foul/card and by this stage of his career should have eradicated the schoolboy errors , Richards looked solid as did Amavi but he needs to overlap more when going forward, there were times the was acres of space but the ball had to be played back to him and then try and dribble forwards rather than bombing on and stretching a very poor Sunderland side. I don’t know who is going to replace Bentekes goal tally, I will be amazed if Gabby, Ayew and Gestede get 10-15 goals between them!! Yesterday Sunderland were there for the taking, and we threw it away against a direct rival in the survival race, no wonder there fans were elated( despite how shit there team is and how they were time wasting from the 75 min)
Tim needed to change things sooner, Gil for Bacuna and Kozak for Gestede but he left it too long and Gil provided the creative spark we were missing, although he needs a real bollocking for diving when it was easier to score!!
I’d bring in Austin even at £15m or we in a league where there are no real shite teams who have been cast adrift we will struggle to stay up.
We should have won that, but we didnt cos we didnt have enough players that could make the difference. First half we were decent but Sunderland were poor tbf. For the second match in a row the opposition made 2 changes at half time and we didnt respond. In this case Sunderland came out much more up for the fight. Their second was a joke and so preventable. Not only did Sanchez lose a battle too easily in a dangerous position, but then Clark makes a powderpuff challenge which is the biggest failure for that goal. Clark should have shown the guy to the outside instead of diving in baldy and letting him in on goal.
Tbf Sanchez was good all game, and besides this and another mistake in the first half when he went sliding in and missed the ball (Richards the saviour otherwise that would have been a goal too) Clark was pretty solid too. Gueye was good if a bit sloppy at times. Westwood had a poor game I feel, he should have contributed more plus should have scored with that volley.
Our shooting altogether was really off, 21 shots only 7 on target? Gestede had a poor game which did nothing to dispell my doubts about him. Sinclair did well for the most part, Bacuna and Hutton were horrible on the right. Dont want to see Bacuna RW again, he even went roaming as a 10 first half?!?! Gil came on and showed that touch of quality, but he couldnt affect the game so much. He should have done better with that one glorious chance but chose to go down in the box instead of trying to get the shot off. Richards was quality at the back, brilliant in winning the ball then setting up that play where he drove forward and almost scored – God knows how he didnt get on the end of that cross, almost as he drove forward a bit too fast?
Not that much more to say, disappointed as that was a bome banker in all honesty. The way the PL is going this year, home advantage might not count so much – not that ut has for us for years, we werent shit, we were just ahead of the times!
Oh a word on Amavi, thought he was really good and back on form, even if he did waste too many crosses. He had one great run when he beat 2 and got in the box, decision making could have been better with the shot instead of the pull back when there were plent waiting in the box.
On reflection yesterdays game should of been a win, errors as always played there part. Clark defended that goalpoorly and seems to take a back seat when paired with a dominating player such as Richards, he did it with Senders and Vlaar last season only coming to life when paired with Okore whom I assume he considers his peer and not his better, is Lescott left sided? unfortunate for Clark as he will play if bought but he only has himself to blame.
Gil should of been on earlier but we have to do more than give him the ball, he’s good but not a miracle worker. Time and again we gave him the ball and spectated, where was the movement to help him create? only Sinclair had it although Gestede improved late on I thought with Gils inclusion.
Unless we have Grealish in with him Gil will only be half of what he could be. Vertoute may be an option but 3 DM won’t hack it.
Thought Gil had every right to go down as there was contact if slight but the way the entire match had gone with the ref wanting to see blood before he blew meant he was never going to get a pen. On another day, another ref he would of got it. when are Refs going to start punishing defenders for laying hands on an opponent to stop him? should be banned, thought it was.
Last moan hit target, put your laces through the ball, once in a while a curled shot will hit target and you look good but a hard direct shot can go in or create a rebound which the rapidly improving sniffer Sinclair might tuck away.
oh and if not Austin or the wolves lad what about another Jordan, Rhodes?
<bYesterday
Though I agree Clark was at fault for their second goal, it was really only a deflection off Richards that enabled their second goal. But Clark should have done better. Their first goal was down to a silly tackle by Amavi which gave them the free kick … but why was Guzan stationed so far to his right? If he’d been more central (even by 12 inches) he’d most likely have saved it. It looks to me that he reckons his right side is weak.
But otherwise both Clark and Amavi played well the rest of the match i.m.o. Clark generally plays in a cool way, and I like that. Yes, too cool for their second I hear you say…!
But I think we’re being picky. The front line has been changed about a fair amount and with 3 absences yesterday (oops, including Gabby) I thought it was a pretty good performance. Not sure why Westy is being picked on though I agree he was not hugely prominent. Perhaps it’s because Sanchez is also in the field? We’ve talked of that before and it doesn’t seem to work too well when both are there … I think Westy gets a little bit lost in his presence.
Even Gestede played well outside the box (a couple of luverly layoffs) but did not provide the strike force necessary. He will probably come good, but I feel that Kozak should have come on with Gil, and we certainly need reinforcing in that department. I’m not sure how Sinclair will fair against the better sides.
Let’s keep patience fellers … we ARE above Chelsea in the table! 😉
We should have won yesterday – we should have taken our chances. Playing Traore against Notts County probably cost us the game along with the sickness bug to Grealish.
Scott Sinclair is looking good and should retain his place as the central striker. He is playing with confidence.
Is the finishing of Gestede any better than Gabby? He gets in good positions at the far post and then always try’s to hit the ball into the opposite corner of the goal which results in him dragging the ball wide. Hit the target Rudy. We should approach Shearer as a forward coach to work with our strikers on their finishing. We clearly need another proven goalscorer at the club – someone who can actually finish.
Bacuna is not a right sided midfield player. He is far more effective playing in a wing back position. I though Hutton got into some decent positions moving forward yesterday but the other players seemed reluctant to pass to him.
Carols Gil needs to start the next game – he has looks really comfortable on the ball and has skills to match.
Sanchez is getting better – Gana looks solid.
Team for the Leicester game
Guzan
Bacuna Clarke Richards Amavi
Gana Sanchez
Traore Gil Grealish
Sinclair
JL- it does seem like knit picking with Clarke but 2 glaring defensive errors 2 games running have cost us. He does seem to perform better in a backs against the wall scenario and is a better player than he’s showing. As you have pointed out with Westwood becoming less of an influence with Sanchez playing the same happens with Clarke IMO.
On the sickness bug, I think the extra fitness work TS is insistent on plus 120 mins of footy for some mid-week lowered their immunity and hey presto something that wouldn’t normally effect a fit person lays them low. From what I’ve seen there is an element of over-training going on at the moment due to us having a pre-season in season in an attempt to catch up.
JL I thought westy also got away with 2 really bad back passes one headed toward our own defence which could of resulted in goals for them luckily they didn’t, very uncharacteristic, he is being asked to play a more attacking role but is more defensively minded, it will take time for him to become effective there but I think Vertoute and even Gardner are better options there going on their previous experience/goals/assists (career wise).
If we are going to play One DM that player has to be Sanchez at the moment. I’m not picking on Westwood he has his merits, Villa need to solve certain positions sooner rather than later and the cleverly role needs addressing, incidentally I thought Gana played very well but has still not got that attacking ability.
One thought is are we seeing a stubbornness in TS in wanting to bring something out in players that may not be there? Bacuna, westy, Gabby come to mind at the moment, just a thought.
Mark: ” it does seem like knit picking with Clarke but 2 glaring defensive errors 2 games running have cost us. ”
3 actually – 2 from Amavi. That “tackle” giving away the free kick was sloppy and in a very dangerous position – as it showed.
But I still wouldn’t slag Amavi as his play balances out his errors – as does Clark’s i.m.o.
JL- lots of free kicks are given through poor tackles doesn’t mean they are goals unless its a pen. whereas a basic error/decision to dive in like Clarks with no cover behind him is schoolboy stuff . unfortunately CB’s are usually the last player before the Goalie and there’s the difference they can’t afford to many errors and as you pointed out Amavi is as much an offensive player as defensive, he messed up and he made a goal. Clark just messed up.
Mark,
It was a totally unnecessary free kick given away in a dangerous area, Mark … that’s the point.
Every time Villa give away a free-kick in that kind of zone I feel the worst.
The guy is inexperienced – I forgive him, but it’s still an error in my book.
Mark,
I also disagree with your sheer dismissal of Clark. He made a mistake, but he’s not expected to go up front and make goals to make up for it, is he?
C’mon … a mistake is a mistake but unless he starts doing it regularly let’s just move on.
JL- He is doing it quite regularly John before these 2 cost us, got too tight to Dann last week, sold himself this week, all things he used to do are creeping back into his game. If I wasn’t noticing a certain nervousness about his play I wouldn’t worry but its there to be seen. Maybe with Amavi pushing up so much its causing him problems but in my experience that is more to do with positioning. There’s a reason there are not to many young CB’s it takes time to play that position well.
I wish you wouldn’t take everything I say as if I’m making it up! its just what I am observing as much as you see what you see.
Mark,
You are one the best artists in existence, so of course you’re granted some licence! 😉
I watch Clark pretty closely as well, and I still like him and just accept that this is all part of the gel-ling factor … that the team is just going to get better as it goes.
What I was really trying to say that Amavi has been equally guilty in my view, but because of his attacking bent he seems to be forgiven his defensive frailties. And I think there you’re right – it may be causing more stress for Clark.
But it’s all OK by me – we’ll get there. Clark and Amavi are not the issues to get stressed about i.m.o.
After all, if all defences were so good they wouldn’t concede goals would they?
JL-
Exactly right. It’s either brilliance on attack or mistakes at the back that lead to goals. You could look at 90-95% of goals scored and point to someone on the other side who should’ve been doing something different or better than what they did.
That said, Clark’s misplaying of that situation was what ultimately made it dangerous. I do like him, and he’s having to adapt to yet another partner, so we’ll see if he settles down. Or if Lescott does come in whether he gets a chance to keep starting. He’ll have a fight on his hands with Okore and Lescott wanting to play.
And on the flipside, free kicks will be given away in dangerous areas…whether from a rash or needless challenge, or a professional foul to minimize danger the player knows he can’t otherwise prevent.
Along with minimizing self-inflicted wounds, what we need to do is convert more set pieces ourselves.
Yes, JC I accept that free kicks will be given away, but for the life of me I can’t see why Amevi “tackled” the way he did. Graham was hardly moving so Amevi had the chance to get round him and tackle him properly but instead goes in from the back .
I just couldn’t nor can’t see the sense of that, particularly in the knowledge that it was a danger area.
But, he’ll hopefully learn from all this.
Incidentally, Charlie Aitken (another l-b with a penchant for attack) had a marvellous tacking ability and in his 660 games I think the number of free kicks he gave away around the penalty area could be counted on one hand – and I wonder if it was as many as that! If I’m right, I don’t think he ever gave a penalty away.
JL- This season so far Clark has 3 yellows in 4 games, Richards for all his physical nature has 0, now from My point of view I’d say that is down to quickness of thought and action. Richards reacts quicker to Danger Clark puts himself in it.
The second goal against Palace which Guzan and Amavi concocted wasn’t helped by Clark retreating, if he had moved to shut down Dann aided by Amavi or even gone halfway to shut Sako’s space down he would of been in a far better position than giving both time on the ball. Its small things like that I notice. Of course everyone makes mistakes but if he continues to be in 2 minds at crucial moments he becomes a problem. That said he has the attributes to be a good defender .
JC- okore seems to be the only partner Clarke has shown his best with, if you remember early last season he was even behind Baker. It wasn’t until all were injured bar him and Okore he shone. He was captain for the reserves and I think he likes to be in charge but with Richards there ( a big personality) he’s not. Sounds strange but I’ve personally seen it happen a lot. The player doesn’t even have to be that good to have this influence a big mouth or a big rep sometimes will do it in lower leagues. I know this is professional footy but put a big player in to this team and players will defer to him.
JL-
Naturally there are going to be head-scratchers…you hope you don’t commit many, and you hope you aren’t made to pay for them.
Part of maturing is being able to keep the big picture in your head even in the heat of battle. Some are always going to be better at it than others. To a certain extent, it probably has to do with the manager and the player’s experience in what he’s singled out for, and what he’s forgiven. Is he going to get criticized more for playing ‘soft’ and letting a move continue, or giving away a needless foul?
I think there was a lot more positives than nevatives performance wise. Sinclair sniffing out goals, Sanchez and Gana, Amavi, Richards and Gil returning to PL action. Negatives inc individual errors, Westwood, Gestede. The biggest negative of all is that we failed to get the result we deserved, we dont want to make that a habit. Good teams manage to sneak a win while playing badly. Relegated teams still lose even when they have played well, mistly due to costly mistakes.
On Clark, I thought he was very solid apart from a couple occasions, one which cost us. He was arguably our player of the season last year, im backing him to keep that going this year. I feel Richards has more mistakes in him tbh, but both should improve as a pair.
Amavi I felt had a very good game, he did concede the foul for their first but its not fair to put that goal on him. The second he was caught outta position but that was down to sloppy play from Westwood and Gestede, then Sanchez losing a battle he was favourite for. He is good going forward but he does not lack defensively, he makes so many tackles, interceptions and clearences every game. He is on his way to be a real star.
One thing that does worry me is the way Sunderland out fought us for the first 10-15 mins of the second half. Going into the derbies its not a good look. I think it just surprised us given how they were first half. But we need to be up for the fight these next few games. Leicester, despite their form, still are not as good a team as us but they are more settled and they will have that fight in them esp for this game. We need to match it at the very least or we could be in for a bad time.
JL- tackling does seem to be a lost art, tackles from behind have never been looked on a safe but these days even if you get a foot to the ball from the side you get pulled up. Maybe its the pace of the game
Ree- Yes Clark was nearly the player of the season that’s why I think he should be better at this point. I think this team will be fine once the dust settles.
Looks like big brother Ayew’s done it again, lets hope it Gee’s little Ayew into action.
http://sportwitness.ning.com/forum/topics/transfer-very-possible-as-likely-newcastle-maybe-aston-villa-prep
Mark: “tackling does seem to be a lost art… . Maybe its the pace of the [modern] game”
Er, when Graham was standing still and leaning back? Sorry, Mark, but that situation sticks out so much it’s laughable. Amavi had time to think about it once, have his breakfast and then think about it again! 🙂
It’s interesting that no-one else seems to have commented about that “tackle” as though they’re all so transfixed by the modern game the thought is that it’s just another free kick. It’s not … it’s a daft giveaway.
But – as said – hopefully he’ll learn from experience.
Mark,
On your various remarks about Clark, I don’t disagree on that score.
My points weren’t about whether he was making any mistakes, and, yes, you’re probably right that he felt more confident with Okore.
Several of us on AVL have said that this is a new team that’s got to find it’s own feet – i.e. it’s not going to readily gel. But I feel sure it will come together in time.
For Clark, though, he may not get any further chance if Lescott takes his place.
Swansea beat Utd yesterday playing good football, with a team that cost £22.2m in total. Andre Ayew was immense and scored his 3rd goal this season, whilst we continue to make excuses for his brother who doesn’t look like a fraction of the player Andre is and we paid £10m more for him.
I can’t see what Gestede and Ayew bring to the party for a combined fee of £16m + 2 lots of wages, because it’s not goals or even an attacking threat on what we have seen this season. I would have rather bought Charlie Austin or Callum Wilson( who TS rates and we were linked to early in the window). I think we have purchased too many gambles , without addressing our main weaknesses. We still need a RB, CB, GK and a CF, with only 1 day left in the transfer window it’s not going to happen, and as we showed against Sunderland we can’t put away the shite teams what hope have we got against the decent ones. I’m already resigned to being in another relegation dogfight, and so is TS going by his comments to date.
B62
Can’t argue with your logic based on what we’ve seen. We’ll know for sure soon. Meanwhile, some more players need to come in or step up.
Charlie Austin being linked to Man Utd, I think we will be going with what have, which I honestly don’t feel is enough, and we will struggle to win football matches which will mean a survival fight.
B62/Trin,
Yes, Swansea are impressive … but they’ve got something going that’s been developing over a few years … TS’s team has barely been going a month and he knows the task is not completed, I’m sure. And the play we see now is a darned sight better than we saw under Lambert i.m.o.
I’ve read comments about the Ayew brothers from someone ITK, who says that Villa’s Ayew is a more of a long-term proposition. So in that sense you’re right that he doesn’t offer an immediate solution and there is a need for someone to make up the Benteke shortfall. On the other hand, perhaps we may see more goals from midfield once the team gels more and the likes of Grealish and Traore return.
Those last two were missing yesterday, and blatantly so, and with them back I don’t see any chance of Villa struggling this season. I see only things to look forward to.
B62 – re the Ayew brothers, the fee for Jordan is a bit of a mystery but plenty have got the fee wrong when transferring Euro’s into pounds. I think the fee was around 10m Euros, which when converted is around £7.3m. Transfermarket.co.uk has got the fee for around £8.4m which seems pretty reasonable, its def not £10m though. With respect to Andre, you have to consider that the signing on free Swansea paid was somewhere in the region of £5m… so not exactly a free. Course we would be paying Jordan a signing on fee too but it would be nowhere near that amount. Iirc Jordan gave up a fee from Lorient in order to push the transfer through, probably his loyalty bonus.
In any case I agree that Andre has settled in so much quicker than Jordan. Thats down to a lot of factors, one being he has come into a settled Swansea team rather than the virtually brand new team we have. Another is that Andre applies himself better, by all accounts Jordan has been touted by most as the more talented of the two, but Andre has had the better career to date. Again it could be down to all kinds of reasons but I think bottom line is Andre applies himself better with the talent he has got than Jordan. Its a disease that has caused so many talented players to not achieve what they potentially could, and something that separates the good players from the great. Jordan has got a couple years on his brother, hopefully he will knuckle down and give that bit extra he needs to become a success.
JL- sorry mate I wasn’t talking about that tackle just tackling in general. I think Clark is very much in danger of losing his spot and would of liked to see him succeed.
B62- big brother looks good doesn’t he, you have to take into account he is slotting into a decent settled side like Swansea not a side in upheaval. I think Tim was banking on Adi being here so spent the money on future potential , still early days though.
Well, there’s no doom and gloom for me…
Remember we’ve bounced along the bottom for the last 4/5 seasons so in essence every team is better than us. But this current bunch of players for the most part don’t carry any of that baggage.
If I look at the quality of play up to the final third, the difference between this season and last is 180 degrees. The midfield and defence are performing very well, possession stats are up, goal attempts are up. We are lacking the killer touch in the final third but I think that is down to patience with a gelling side and the results our play deserves will follow.
We are no longer playing relegation style football with relegation style players, I think our midfield has to learn how Gestede wants the ball played up to him but I’d agree we are a striker/RB/Keeper away from being a complete team and maybe there was no money forthcoming from Lerner just a promise to allow all of the Benteke money to be reinvested. But this isn’t a bad place to be. It means that for the next few transfer windows we just have to tinker with the squad bar bigger clubs coming in for the likes of Amavi or Adama as opposed to complete rebuilds.
The rush to get the past behind us and to be obscure in midtable may be the achievement at the end of the season but it doesn’t happen in 4 games.
So far a solid win v Bournemouth which could have been a complete banana skin
A missed point v Man U with them winning by a deflected shot
A missed win v Palace and look what they did to Chelsea with Palace drawing by an individual mistake by Guzan imo
A missed win v Sunderland when our dominance just didn’t pay off
We aren’t that far away from where we need to be results wise. There are no bad sides in the Prem judging by results just inconsistency.
Patience is a virtue especially when being a Villan that may be in short supply but with not too many internationals in our side. Tim can work further on gelling the team and getting Adama, Grealish and Gabby back will add to competition for places and better performances.
UTV
Have to agree with most of what you said DoR, we shouldnt be too quick to judge. The team needs time to settle and we should look at the situation then. At least 10 games to get an idea where we’re at, maybe half the season to see where we could finish. The problem is the PL is unforgiving and the games come thick and fast, each game more important than the last. By the time we are up to speed we could be in trouble already, so we need to get results on the board while in that settling period.
If you think what would par be for those opening 4 fixtures Id suggest 5 points from them. So we are slightly under par, but given that Grealish has only played 1 game, and Gil and Traore have had less than 1 half playing time between them, I think we can be satisfied with 4 points. Even still its pretty conceivable that we could be on 8 points right now, on the flip side we could just as easily be on 2. So we’re doing ok, nowhere near as good as we started last season but much more promise for the future. At least we dont have that horror run of fixtures that catapulted us into deep shit.
Next 2 games will be very important for morale, and we need to make sure we aint out fought. Football wise I think we’re better than both of them, but we need to show the fight needed for the derbies.
I see where we’re being linked to Swansea’s Bafetimbi Gomis (yet another Frenchman!).
I think I remember Jenny saying last season that she fancied his abilities … anyone else have a view?
Ree,
But it’s nice to know that Chelsea also have to be concerned about their position in the league!
4 games is *very* early in the season. If after 10 games we’re not showing any improvement results-wise *then* I might start worrying.
John Chelsea will no doubt be there or thereabouts come the end of the season. Where we finish is up in the air, could be 8th could be 18th – probably somewhere in between. The fact that we are ahead of them at this moment in time means nothing tbh. Could be wrong but we were ahead of them this time last season? Or at least very close given the fact we got 10 points outta 12.
Texas – for me Gomis is a downgrade on Bony who is a downgrade on Benteke. Decent enough striker but thrives on confidence and needs others to create the chances for him. Gestede played poorly last game, but he didnt really have any ‘good’ chances created for him tbf. If we were creating like Swansea are creating atm he would be scoring just as many as Gomis.
Re,
The bit about Chelsea was just to lighten the atmosphere! 🙂
Of course I don’t take their current placing seriously, but what it does do is to emphasise that we’re in the very early stage of the season. There’s a very long way to go yet and we probably won’t be able to see what’s developing at VP until mid-way through October.
A luverly story…
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/brave-aston-villa-fan-tom-9963846
Sad to say why the hell would gomis leave the swans for us?! Non starter.
Chap on ssn stroke a chord saying a good team must have a good gk and striker. We dont
JL- puts things into perspective doesn’t it, we all want success for the club but some things money cannot buy
Baggies signed evans, lidergaard and prob wilson on loan….solid business.
Come on villa big day for us tomorrow
Andrew:
re WBA signings versus ours, we’ve signed Amavi, Gana, Richards, Traore, and Sinclair — and that’s not including the possible positives of the rest of our new players.
That’s five solid first-team givens. Although you and I both want (at the very least) a new striker and new right back, I still think that this window was our best in years.
Texas now im hearing austin to baggies. That will break me.
Its certainly been a window of change but does signing alot of players count as good.
Massive holes in our team are cb ( soon to be ok with lescott) rb, gk and a striker. With gk and striker very important positions.
Love the potential of adama and grealish together but pinning our hopes on 2 19 year olds is a big big ask. Amavi looks great along with gana but havesigned a goal scoring midfielder?
Im just worried other teams seem to be strengthining very well and we are allready starting well behind them.
just seen something involving Berbatov in brum
http://talksport.com/football/aston-villa-transfer-news-berbatov-and-lescott-adebayor-heading-west-ham-150901164960?